Hebrews 6:4-6 Am I in trouble?

[clang]

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the coming age, if they fall away to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
This is my question.[and my fear] Is this scripture talking about backsliding?

I grew up in a very strong Christian home with two wonderful, Godly parents and 4 siblings who I love dearly. I was
saved as a young boy and baptized a few years later. We went to a very strict but Biblically sound Baptist church. I went
to a Christian school and highschool. As a young man, I started to backslide with much sin in my life.I stopped going to
church or reading the Bible. I began experimenting with drugs and also had a lot of sex outside of marriage. These are
just a few of my many sins as there are too many to list here. Now, I never stopped believing that Jesus is the Son of God and that He died on the cross for me and was resurrected. I did however get very angry with God a few times,
even using foul language in my rage. I have repented of my sins and still do.
In the last 8 years or so, I have begun to restore my relationship with God. In particular, My time here at FP has been
especially rewarding as I have gotten back into reading the Word and praying to our Father in heaven. This is not to
say I have all of a sudden become some holy man because I still have way to much sin in my life. Little white lies, an
addiction to cigarettes and other sins are still a daily struggle.
So again, I ask is this scripture talking about backsliding? Could it mean that I was never saved in the first place and
I still need to accept Christ as my savior? Or maybe it means a Christian can't convert to Islam and back again or
become an athiest and back again. I just don't know. I do know that I never ever doubted that Jesus was the only way
to salvation. Your thoughts and prayers on this subject will be greatly appreciated and don't worry about hurting my
feelings. It is my eternal soul that I am concerned with. Could I have blown my only chance?

Although it does not answer all my questions, James 5:19-20 did give me some peace on this subject and I can only
believe That God put that in the Bible for that very reason. What a great savior we have.
Please pray.

[Abiding in His Word]

Hi clang,

If you're in trouble, I guess many of us might be as well. It's my understanding that this verse has been the topic of much controversy over the years. I'm a firm believer in refusing to make doctrine from one verse in scripture but rather letting scripture interpret scripture. This particular passage directly contradicts Jesus' teaching on the Prodigal son (Luke 15:1), the one sheep that has strayed (Matt. 18:12), His faithful forgiveness of our sins (1 John 1:9). Luke 15:10 reminds us that there is joy in heaven when one sinner repents...are we not sinners? We also read of God's longsuffering toward His own people over and over throughout the OT.

Some sheep stray for a longer period of time than others, but praise God, there is joy in heaven when the Good Shephered returns them to the fold!

[extravagantchristian]

Hi clang, no one here can tell you if your were ever saved to begin with. Believing in God is not enough to save us. I think that if a person is really saved, they will be able to look back on their life and know that there was a time when they died to themselves and their own desires including sin, in order to live for God. We should be able to see a clear change in our lives between our life before salvation and after. It does concern me that you don't know for sure if you are saved. Based on my own experience, I think a person would know if there was ever a time when the Spirit of God came to live inside of them. I'm not saying you're not saved, I'm just saying, that is the evidence I would look for.

It's easy to accept Christ as our saviour, but has there ever been a time in your life when you made a commitment to be faithful to the Lord (including repentance from sin) and followed through with it?

Luke 9:23
Then He said to them all, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me.

It is never too late for a person who wants to get right with God weather they are saved or not. "Repent and be converted that your sins may be blotted out." Acts 3:19.

Don't let the devil lie to you and tell you that you've gone too far, he wants us to lose heart.

I herd a great sermon the other day, the pastor gave the greek definition of the term "lose heart"...
Abandoning one's self to cowardly surrender.

Galatians 6:9
And let us not grow weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart.

Psalm 103:13
As a father pities his children,So the LORD pities those who fear Him.

Psalm 147:11
The LORD takes pleasure in those who fear Him,In those who hope in His mercy.

[Mrs. B]

Hebrews 6:46 Am I in trouble?


Read Hebrews 5:14.....But strong meat belongeth to them that are of FULL AGE,
even those who by reason of use have their sences exercised to discern good and evil...

6:1....Therefore.....Leaving the Principles of the doctrine of Christ.....
Let us go on unto Perfection;
Not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works,
and of faith toward God,
2..Of the Doctrine of Baptisms
and of the laying on of hands,\and of ressurrection of the dead,
and eternal judgment...
3.....And this will we do if God permit...

Now all that being said......

4...FOR IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR THOSE
WHo were once enlightened, and have tasted of the Heavenly gift,
and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
5..and have tasted the good word ofGod, and the Powerw of the world to come...
6.....If they shall fall away,
to renew them again unto Repentance;
seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and
put him to an open shame..


This has to be a Mature Christian....One who understands
one who delibertly...knowing God and turning His back on Him...

You are like the Protical Son...
He went from His Fathers House.....and fell into sin...
Then came to Himself and Returned....again to His Father's House
And what did the Father do..
He put a ring on his hand....killed the fatted Calf....but a Robe on him and
was waiting for His Return.....Rejoicing when He saw Him coming..

You see...if you had commited the unpardable sin...you would have no desire to return...

Look at Peter.....He denyed Jesus three times.....
and Jesus said when he arose from the dead.....Go Tell Peter..and the disciples that I Am risen...
We all have sin....even after coming to Jesus....But If we confess our sin....He is Faithful and Just to forgive us all our sin......
Now....Repent of Sin... confess it to Jesus and ask Him to give you Power over the sin in your life......and He Will...
He has given us the Holy Spirit to give us power over sin in our life...
When we confess it and repent of our sin.....this is the beginning of turning totally to Him...

John 1:8....If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us...
9....If we Confess our sins...he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins,
and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness..

10...If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and His Word is not in us..

2:1....My Little Children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not...
And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the Righteous:

2...And he is the propitiation for our sins:
and Not for ours only, But also for the Sins of the Whole World....

I Peter 1:3....Blessed be the God and Father of Our Lord Jesus Christ,
which according to His Abundant Mercy hath Begotten Us AGAIN unto a lively hope...by the ressrection of Jesus Christ from the Dead..

4....TO AN INHERITANCE INCORRUPTIBLE..and undefiled, and that fadeth Not Away...Reserved in Heaven for you,
5...Who are Kept by the Power of God through Faith Unto Salvation ready to be reveled in the last time....

13....Wherefore Gird up the Loins of your Mind, Be Sober, and Hope to the end for the Grace that is to be brought unto you at the Revelation of Jesus Christ;

14...As Obedient Children, not fashioning your selves according to the former lust in your ingornance:

15....But as he which Hath CALLED YOU is Holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation..
16....Because it is written....BE YE HOLY....For I AM HOLY...


Mrs. B

[Abiding in His Word]

You see...if you had commited the unpardable sin...you would have no desire to return...

Look at Peter.....He denyed Jesus three times.....
and Jesus said when he arose from the dead.....Go Tell Peter..and the disciples that I Am risen...
We all have sin....even after coming to Jesus....But If we confess our sin....He is Faithful and Just to forgive us all our sin......

Nicely said, Mrs. B.

[plalgum]

Hi Clang,
Reading your post,i could have been reading about myself,our Lord came looking for you, did he not?And here you are now!Just like myself.He is the good shepherd,and he does look for his lost sheep,and he will not lose one of them.AMEN!

[Grets Sirob]

This particular passage directly contradicts Jesus' teaching on the Prodigal son (Luke 15:1), the one sheep that has strayed (Matt. 18:12), His faithful forgiveness of our sins (1 John 1:9).

Just wanted to jump in here and say that that's not true... Scripture never contradicts itself. Sometimes it seems to, but this is only because our understanding of it is imperfect. It all works together. We just don't know how all the time. :)

In any case, I would agree with what's been said so far, that this is more an issue of the prodigal son.

I guess you could look at the difference between Peter, who denied he knew Yeshua, and Judas, who actually betrayed Him. Both were disciples. Neither of them were faithful. But one became one of the most influential leaders of the Church... and the other hung himself.

[Abiding in His Word]

Just wanted to jump in here and say that that's not true... Scripture never contradicts itself. Sometimes it seems to, but this is only because our understanding of it is imperfect. It all works together. We just don't know how all the time. :)

Hi Grets,

I didn't evidently make myself clear. Sorry. What I meant was that if we read that with the understanding that if we sin we cannot return in repentence (as clang feared) then it contradicts other scriptures. And so we need to see it in a different light with a better understanding since scripture does not contradict scripture. Hope that clarifies my previous post.

[clang]

I thank you all for your thoughtful responses and I truly feel the love between brothers and sisters here at FP. I don't
really doubt my salvation but this passage in Hebrews is saying something here and I just can't figure it out yet. I have
prayed about it and I am waiting patiently on God to tell me what He means. In fact, there were more eye openers in
Hebrews than any other portion of scripture for me. I have never felt the Holy Spirit convicting me more than when I was
reading it.
Although I believe all your answers are true, I don't think anyone said what they believe this passage really means.
God bless you my friends.

[Abiding in His Word]

clang, I can only pass on what one commentator says that I find a reasonable explanation:

For it is impossible. There are sins that have no forgiveness (Mat_12:31-32). There are Apostates who can never find a place for repentance, not because of the failure of God's mercy, but because they have destroyed their moral capacity for a heartfelt repentance. Usually the most hardened sinner are apostates.

Some who have tasted the goodness of the Lord and the gospel have become so hardened (for whatever the reason) that their heart will not repent and therefore they bring shame to the gospel.

[AndCanItBe]

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the coming age, if they fall away to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
This is my question.[and my fear] Is this scripture talking about backsliding?

Hi clang! I don't think it's talking about backsliding. I think it's talking about renouncing your birthright, which in my mind means deliberately throwing away your salvation, because later on in Hebrews 12, we read

15See to it that no one comes short of the grace of God; that no root of bitterness springing up causes trouble, and by it many be defiled;

16that there be no immoral or godless person like Esau, who sold his own birthright for a single meal.

17For you know that even afterwards, when he desired to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no place for repentance, though he sought for it with tears.

[clang]

I am sorry Mrs B. I do think you did give your interpretation after I read all the posts again. Thank you all again.
I have confessed my sins and many have been left behind. Some still haunt me and it was not easy confessing them
here. That is why praying for each other is so important.

[extravagantchristian]

Clang, I think it may very well mean what it says. I think it may be possible for a person to leave their salvation. We do have free will. Although I will tell you, I have been through very dark periods of backsliding and trouble with sin, and God has been unbelievably patient with me and has never left me. I know others will tell you the same.

Think about the difference between Peter and Judas, that may be the key. They both betrayed Jesus, but Peter repented and came back to the Lord, and Judas ran from Him.

[clang]

The answers are coming fast and furious now. What a blessing you all are in my life.

[Mrs. B]

Hebrews 6:4-6 Am I in trouble?


The Hebrew writter....which I believe is Paul...

If you will read these scriptures and meditate on them...You will see that Paul is talking about a Mature Christian...
Some one who is mature in the Word...and the Knowledge of the Lord...

Notice...
But strong Meat...the meat of the Gospel....belongeth to them that are of full age...even those who by reason of use, even those who by Reason of Use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil....

this is talking about some one that is Mature...and has tasted of the good word of God....and the powerss of the world to come...
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God....afresh, and put him to an open shame....


Someone like Jim Jones....He was a Spirit filled Christian....But look how he failed.....
He crossed the line......
If we have Godly Sorrow for our sins and repent.....God is full of Mercy

And we come back to Jesus for forgivness....He Hears Us.....and Is Full of Mercy not willing that any should perish...


Years ago.....when we were young.....The President of the World National Churches...
wrote......I once believed in Jesus but now....I've grown to realize that that is not necessary...

He turned from Jesus..
How can he be saved......? He denyies the Only One Who can save Him......
There is only one way....Jesus is the Way......If we deny Him there is No Other Way...
How can he be saved...? If we deny Him we choose to go it alone....

Now what you say....That you were raised in a Christian Family...Christian School....
and you turned away......because the pull of the world is out there.....we must saperate ourselves from the world and give our hearts totally to Jesus.....
You have tasted of the good word of God and you have tasted of the World.....But Praise the Lord you have Returned....to the God of Your Fathers....Glory..Praise His Name forever...

Mrs. B

[OBXBob]

Deuteronomy 4:29 But if from there you seek the LORD your God, you will find him if you look for him with all your heart and with all your soul.

[Mrs. B]

This is My song....I love this song...I love the words.....I cry every time I hear it....
May the words bless you....bb



You Make your Mercy New.......

I ....thought that I had crossed the line
walked away from Love..... one time.... too many

I.....thought I'd had used up all the grace
set a side for my mistakes.....
so many
on my knees....I found to My Surprise
that your mercy....renewed with each sunrise

Oh.. you make your mercy new every day
you changed my life in so many ways
cradle me in your sweet goodness
you fill me....yea
yesterday today forever more
there is one thing I know for sure
fresh as the morning dew
you make your mercy new....every morning

Oh...wasted times that I have known
prodical away from home......
not knowing
every day your grace was multiplie...
with forgivness.... waiting to provide

You make your mercy new every day
you change my life in so many ways
you cradle me in your sweet grace
you fill me....
yesterday today forever more
there's one thing I know for sure
Fresh as the morning dew
you make your mercy new....every morning

On my knees I found to My surprise
that your mercy is renew

Oh... waisted times that I have known
Protical away from home
not knowing
Every day your Grace was multiplied
with forgivness...waiting to provide

O you make your mercy new every day
you change my life in so many ways
you cradle me in your sweet goodness
you fill me

yesterday today forever more
there is one thing I know for sure
Fresh as the moring dew
you make your mercy new....every morning...

to save the entire world..How much grace would it take.....
when the sun comes up.......
there will...be... enough
Oh... you make your mercy new
every morning
you change my life in so many ways
you cradle me in your sweet goodness
you fill me...
yestserday today forevery more
there is one thing I know for sure
fresh as the morning dew
you make your mercy new every morning..
you make your mercy new every morning
you make your mercy new every morning...o yea

you cradle me in you sweet goodness
you fill me
yesterday today forever more
There is one thing I know for sure
fresh as the morning dew...
you make your mercy new every morning
yuu make your mercy new....every morining...o yea
every morning when the sun comes up
there would be enough

yesterday today forever more
there is one thing I know for sure
fresh as the morning dew ...
you make your mercy new every morning

To save the entire world
How much grace would it take
when the sun comes up....there will be enough

O you make your mercy knew every day
you change my life in so many ways
you cradle me in your sweet goodness
you fill me

yesterday today forever more
there's one thing I know for sure.
fresh as the morning dew
You make your mercy new
every morning...
you make your mercy new...
every morning.....O yea


Mrs. B

[GodsStudent]

Hi Mrs. B:

God Bless you, dear lady.

The song you posted above, I tried to find it on the internet and youtube and couldn't...I wanted to listen to it.

Do you know of any artists who may have sung this?

[Mrs. B]

The name of the album is........ Where strength Begins
The name of the song is....New Mercy
by Philip, Craig & Dean



Here is a link where you can get it from Wal Mart



http://mp3.walmart.com/store/artist?tra ... erralLink=<a%20href='/store/search/all%3Fkeyword%3Dnew%20mercy'>Search%20Results</a>

[GodsStudent]

Thank you and God Bless you. I enjoy reading your posts here on FP.

Edited to update this comment and add that I bought this CD online and downloaded to my computer....(nothing like instant gratification and shame on me).....but Mrs. B, this is the kind of music that I enjoy listening to, and I wanted to say a more emphatic thank you !!! I have resorted to a lot of classical music these days because I just cannot take the secular, and even contemporary christian music seems to make my brain smash against the side of my skull, and it just doesn't sooth me....the slower songs on this groups album are contemplative and soothing....THANK YOU.

[rabka4]

Another good thing to remember while studying the bible is context. The book of Hebrews was written to the Jewish believers at that time, some had returned to sacrificing ...which in effect by the mere act would make Jesus death and blood "not good enough to cover ALL sin". We know that is not true, the Holy Spirit draws us by grace and by grace we are saved not by works of our hands (or by the blood of animals), not by works of the law, not by ANYTHING we do. Therefore to apply this to our lives as believers, if we went back to believing that somehow any of the "good works" we do are what is going to save us then Hebrews 6 .. or 10 for that matter would apply. However it is my belief that once we have truly tasted and know the goodness and grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, we will not go back to thinking that salvation is in any way accomplished or taken away by what we do or how we fail at times. Roman 8:38-39 Nothing separates us from Him. True faith draws back a lost sheep. You are safe in His arms.

[Douggg]

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the coming age, if they fall away to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
This is my question.[and my fear] Is this scripture talking about backsliding?

No, you are not in any trouble as far as salvation goes. Hebrews 6:4-6 is someone who once embraced Jesus but leaves Him and renounces him before men, usually in a very bitter way. I run into people all the time like that in my discussions at non-Christian discussion sites.

If you are struggling with certain sins, just go to God in prayer and ask for forgiveness and help....just as ever other Christian does because as long as we are in these bodies we all are going to struggle with certain sins.

What you don't have to ask for is atonement, which deals with the punishment for our sins, past, present, future. Which is the really good news and the joy of our salvation. We have one atonement forever. Jesus's shed blood provides for us perpetual atonement, working 24/7, 365 days a year, keeping our souls spotless from sin - which even when we do sin, his atoning blood breaks the power of sin to stain our souls. And that is why we are acceptable to God - because of what Jesus did on the cross.

Doug L.

[thykingdomcome]

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the coming age, if they fall away to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
This is my question.[and my fear] Is this scripture talking about backsliding?

I grew up in a very strong Christian home with two wonderful, Godly parents and 4 siblings who I love dearly. I was
saved as a young boy and baptized a few years later. We went to a very strict but Biblically sound Baptist church. I went
to a Christian school and highschool. As a young man, I started to backslide with much sin in my life.I stopped going to
church or reading the Bible. I began experimenting with drugs and also had a lot of sex outside of marriage. These are
just a few of my many sins as there are too many to list here. Now, I never stopped believing that Jesus is the Son of God and that He died on the cross for me and was resurrected. I did however get very angry with God a few times,
even using foul language in my rage. I have repented of my sins and still do.
In the last 8 years or so, I have begun to restore my relationship with God. In particular, My time here at FP has been
especially rewarding as I have gotten back into reading the Word and praying to our Father in heaven. This is not to
say I have all of a sudden become some holy man because I still have way to much sin in my life. Little white lies, an
addiction to cigarettes and other sins are still a daily struggle.
So again, I ask is this scripture talking about backsliding? Could it mean that I was never saved in the first place and
I still need to accept Christ as my savior? Or maybe it means a Christian can't convert to Islam and back again or
become an athiest and back again. I just don't know. I do know that I never ever doubted that Jesus was the only way
to salvation. Your thoughts and prayers on this subject will be greatly appreciated and don't worry about hurting my
feelings. It is my eternal soul that I am concerned with. Could I have blown my only chance?

Although it does not answer all my questions, James 5:19-20 did give me some peace on this subject and I can only
believe That God put that in the Bible for that very reason. What a great savior we have.
Please pray.

(Eze.18:27-28) (v.27) Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive. (v.28) Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

And this is referring to the second death, turn from wickedness and seek God with your whole heart. No you have not blown your only chance. God gives you one long chance called life.

(Mat.11:28) Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

(Mat.12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

If you have to ask yourself what is “blasphemy against the Holy Ghost” then there’s a good chance you haven’t done it.

Peace

[brandon]

I agree with an above posted: Hebrews 6: 4-6 is a terrifying passage, especially when read "on its own". Read it in context of the letter, and it becomes less terrifying, and it becomes part of a great encouragement to move forward in the Christian faith. Hebrews is an exhortation to Hebrew Christians who were being tempted to backslide into Judaism's sacrificial system. We know from various passages therein that these were mature believers, who had suffered in Christ's name and who had a history of producing fruit in their lives.

The verses being noted here are not stand alone. They are intimately connected to what was said immediately before and after it.

Note the glory found in verses 9-12:

9 Though we speak in this way, yet in your case, beloved, we feel sure of better things—things that belong to salvation. 10 For God is not unjust so as to overlook your work and the love that you have shown for his name in serving the saints, as you still do. 11 And we desire each one of you to show the same earnestness to have the full assurance of hope until the end, 12 so that you may not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

The writer is NOT threatening them with condemnation in the previous verses, hence the assurance. The condemnation of a hypocrite or apostate is a terrifying subject, but it is being used by the writer as an encouragement to press on in the faith.

It was noted in the OSAS thread that the example found here in Hebrews seems to be just like the thorny ground hearer of Jesus' parable of the sower. The Gospel falls on all indiscriminately, but only the good soil produces fruit. However, the Gospel seems to take root in some, and this parable shows two examples where someone who looked like they were a Christian was shown to not be so by the lack of fruit in their lives. The problem wasn't with the seed, but with the ground.

In numerous other parables, Jesus notes that in general, the Gospel is like a net that catches both good and bad fish; that there are both wheat and tares in the Church. This will be the case from Jesus' ministry on and up to His return. Much of the time those who have bad soil seem to grow something from the Gospel seed, but ultimately the bad soil is shown to be just that. Now, were they actually saved? No, for God will save His elect whom He has chosen. The Gospel has power to impact even the lives of the wicked for a time. In the psalms it mentions a time where even the wicked feign obedience to law. Truly some shall feign belief in the Gospel, but eventually they will be found out, through falling away or having no fruit.

The message of Hebrews is "press on, press forward, keep moving, never stop." Even though those elect have eternal assurance, we must, as Peter says, "make our calling and election sure." Works are an outflow of real inner faith in Jesus, and every Christian is commanded to produce them and continue producing them. Hebrews has many assurances and warnings. Some, comforted into a false sense of security that they can live and do what they want without consequence will find Hebrews to be a startling wake up call.