Wallmart and Dearborn -America's Kosovo

[Exit40]

Bok, I'm with you. I don't get the angle on the outrage either. Selling food to an ethnic group does not constitute dhimmitude, it constitutes capitalism. And while islam does it's best to take over the US I am sure our decadent ways will infiltrate even them and corrupt them, as it has done to our own churches. In the case of the muslims and our appeasement of them, methinks there is too much protest from both sides on this issue. If we allow our freedoms and liberties the chance I suspect even some within islam will come to their senses. Really, when the young muslim women get a taste of American liberal culture they will turn. Liberty, granted by the Lord in this nation, is a fire that cannot be put out. Laws passed by muslim communities that are contrary to our national freedoms will not stand eventually. The pendulum can swing only one direction at a time. Our Faithful witness and prayer is the factor, and within the laws of this land, that will slow it and it will take it's own natural direction after it stops, by the Will of our Lord.

Be Patient and Faithful, let the Lord fight the battle, let us do our part also, but let us not fear this evil which cannot kill the soul. Think about these poor folks who are trapped by this evil. I wonder, who has seen an oppressed people that crave the liberty granted by this country. Who has seen the suffering of the lesser ones at the hands of evil ones. Who are we to say you can't eat your food, while denying them Bread. That is what we are doing here with this attitude. I'm done with this thread.

God Bless You

David

[bok]

Bok willing ignorance on your part...willing ignorance.

Sword,

I have Muslim employees. I have Hindu employees. How should I witness to them? By accepting them as they are, or by condemning their culture?

Should I invite my Hindu employees over for hamburgers and then try to convince them why they need Jesus? I would send them running. Let me tell you, I love baby back (pork) ribs, but I wouldn't eat them in front of my Muslim friends (though I have a few Muslim friends who would grill them with me).

Did you know that in Saudi Arabia, there are people who see the image on a can of infant formula and think that Americans eat babies? I know it's crazy, but if I was trying to send humanitarian aid to Saudi Arabia, I'd avoid sending "powdered baby".

My point is that there are ways to accommodate people's differences without it meaning that you're buying into their way of life, or even their crazy beliefs. And by making reasonable accommodations, you get what you give. If you want them to open up to you and listen to your point of view, a little sympathy wouldn't hurt.

It just seems to me that the list of "things to be scared about" is rather boring. I'm not buying into the xenophobia. There are more important things to fear than an Arabian Bazaar at Wal Mart.

We don't have to make people be just like us to teach them the gospel and help them into salvation. The conquistadors tried that, remember. And it's a black mark upon the church forever.

So I would walk into the Arab-ified Wal Mart in Dearborn and show them some Jesus. A good friend of mine says, "I measure success by the amount of Jesus people see in me." And no... he doesn't wear the Christian t-shirt.

[Sword of Geddon]

The point is that most Mosques in the US teach radical Islam, and they want to take over the US. This attitude that if people are offended by something we should cave in has to stop. If someone doesn't like a nativity scene, too bad, are a Christmas tree. Its called Political correctness. Tolerance.

[Rte66]

After reading this thread this morning, I came across this in my reading of Scriptures and I feel it is very applicable to this situation.

Isaiah Chapter 8


Isa 8:1 Then the LORD said to me, "Take for yourself a large tablet and write on it in ordinary letters: Swift is the booty, speedy is the prey.
Isa 8:2 "And I will take to Myself faithful witnesses for testimony, Uriah the priest and Zechariah the son of Jeberechiah."
Isa 8:3 So I approached the prophetess, and she conceived and gave birth to a son. Then the LORD said to me, "Name him Maher-shalal-hash-baz;
Isa 8:4 for before the boy knows how to cry out 'My father' or 'My mother,' the wealth of Damascus and the spoil of Samaria will be carried away before the king of Assyria."
Isa 8:5 Again the LORD spoke to me further, saying,
Isa 8:6 "Inasmuch as these people have rejected the gently flowing waters of Shiloah And rejoice in Rezin and the son of Remaliah;
Isa 8:7 "Now therefore, behold, the Lord is about to bring on them the strong and abundant waters of the Euphrates, {Even} the king of Assyria and all his glory; And it will rise up over all its channels and go over all its banks.
Isa 8:8 "Then it will sweep on into Judah, it will overflow and pass through, It will reach even to the neck; And the spread of its wings will fill the breadth of your land, O Immanuel.
Isa 8:9 "Be broken, O peoples, and be shattered; And give ear, all remote places of the earth. Gird yourselves, yet be shattered; Gird yourselves, yet be shattered.
Isa 8:10 "Devise a plan, but it will be thwarted; State a proposal, but it will not stand, For God is with us."


Apply the above description of the fall of Israel to the Assyrians to the taking over of our country by Muslims...what did the Lord instruct the prophet Isaiah to do back then....




Isa 8:11 For thus the LORD spoke to me with mighty power and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
Isa 8:12 "You are not to say, '{It is} a conspiracy!' In regard to all that this people call a conspiracy, And you are not to fear what they fear or be in dread of {it.}

Verses 11 and 12 say to me in regards to the subject of this thread...I am not to go along with all of the people who are so afraid of the conspiracy of the Muslims to take over this country let alone their outrage that Walmart is offering ethnic foods to Arabs.



Isa 8:13 "It is the LORD of hosts whom you should regard as holy. And He shall be your fear, And He shall be your dread.
Isa 8:14 "Then He shall become a sanctuary; But to both the houses of Israel, a stone to strike and a rock to stumble over, {And} a snare and a trap for the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Interesting but this sounds to me that the Lord becomes a snare to His people in Israel and Jerusalem.


Isa 8:15 "Many will stumble over them, Then they will fall and be broken; They will even be snared and caught."
Isa 8:16 Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples.
Isa 8:17 And I will wait for the LORD who is hiding His face from the house of Jacob; I will even look eagerly for Him.


Matthew Henry's commentary: courtesy of Blue letter Bible


2. Now what is it that he says to God’s people?

(1.) He cautions them against a sinful fear, v. 12. It seems it was the way of this people at this time, and fear is catching. He whose heart fails him makes his brethren’s heart to fail, like his heart (Deu. 20:8); therefore Say you not, A confederacy, to all those to whom this people shall say, A confederacy; that is, [1.] "Be not associated with them in the confederacies they are projecting and forecasting for. Do not join with those that, for the securing of themselves, are for making a league with the Assyrians, through unbelief, and distrust of God and their cause. Do not come into any such confederacy.’’ Note, It concerns us, in time of trouble, to watch against all such fears as put us upon taking any indirect courses for our own security. [2.] "Be not afraid of the confederacies they frighten themselves and one another with. Do not distress yourselves with the apprehension of a confederacy upon every thing that stirs, nor, when any little thing is amiss, cry out presently, There is a plot, a plot. When they talk what dismal news there is, Syria is joined with Ephraim, what will become of us? must we fight, or must we flee, or must we yield? do not you fear their fear: Be not afraid of the signs of heaven, as the heathen are, Jer. 10:2. Be not afraid of evil tidings on earth, but let your hearts be fixed. Fear not that which they fear, nor be afraid as they are. Be not put into such a fright as causes trembling and shaking;’’ so the word signifies. Note, When the church’s enemies have sinful confederacies on foot the church’s friends should watch against the sinful fears of those confederacies.

(2.) He advises them to a gracious religious fear: But sanctify the Lord of hosts himself, v. 13. Note, The believing fear of God is a special preservative against the disquieting fear of man; see 1 Pt. 3:14, 15, where this is quoted, and applied to suffering Christians. [1.] We must look upon God as the Lord of hosts, that has all power in his hand and all creatures at his beck. [2.] We must sanctify him accordingly, give him the glory due to that name, and behave towards him as those that believe him to be a holy God. [3.] We must make him our fear, the object of our fear, and make him our dread, keep up a reverence of his providence and stand in awe of his sovereignty, be afraid of his displeasure and silently acquiesce in all his disposals. Were we but duly affected with the greatness and glory of God, we should see the pomp of our enemies eclipsed and clouded, and all their power restrained and under check; see Neh. 4:14. Those that are afraid of the reproach of men forget the Lord their Maker, ch. 51:12, 13. Compare Lu. 12:4, 5.

(3.) He assures them of a holy security and serenity of mind in so doing (v. 14): "He shall be for a sanctuary; make him your fear, and you shall find him your hope, your help, your defence, and your mighty deliverer. He will sanctify and preserve you. He will be for a sanctuary,’’ [1.] "To make you holy. He will be your sanctification;’’ so some read it. If we sanctify God by our praises, he will sanctify us by his grace. [2.] "To make you easy. He will be your sanctuary,’’ to which you may flee for safety, and where you are privileged form all the arrests of fear; you shall find an inviolable refuge and security in him, and see yourselves our of the reach of danger. Those that truly fear God shall not need to fear any evil.

III. He threatens the ruin of the ungodly and unbelieving, both in Judah and Israel. They have no part nor lot in the foregoing comforts; that God who will be a sanctuary to those who trust in him will be a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, to those who leave these waters of Shiloah, and rejoice in Rezin and Remaliah’s son, (v. 6), who make the creature their fear and their hope, v. 14, 15. The prophet foresees that the greatest part of both the houses of Israel would not sanctify the Lord of hosts, and to them he would be for a gin and a snare; he would be a terror to them, as he would be a support and stay to those that trusted in him. Instead of profiting by the word of God, they should be offended at it; and the providences of God, instead of leading them to him, would drive them from him. What was a savour of life unto life to others would be a savour of death unto death to them. "So that many among them shall stumble and fall; they shall fall both into sin and into ruin; they shall fall by the sword, shall be taken prisoners, and go into captivity.’’ Note, If the things of God be an offence to us, they will be an undoing to us. Some apply this to the unbelieving Jews, who rejected Christ, and to whom he became a stone of stumbling; for the apostle quotes this scripture with application to all those who persisted in their unbelief of the gospel of Christ (1 Pt. 2:8); to them he is a rock of offence, because, being disobedient to the word, they stumble at it.


I find that I'd put all of this commentary in bold to highlight the important points. All of it is something I want to point out. Please read carefully.

[CorporalJohnny]

This Wal-Mart thing isn't nearly as big a problem as Keith Ellison is.

[mark s]

Rte66 wrote:

Isa 8:11 For thus the LORD spoke to me with mighty power and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
Isa 8:12 "You are not to say, '{It is} a conspiracy!' In regard to all that this people call a conspiracy, And you are not to fear what they fear or be in dread of {it.}

Verses 11 and 12 say to me in regards to the subject of this thread...I am not to go along with all of the people who are so afraid of the conspiracy of the Muslims to take over this country let alone their outrage that Walmart is offering ethnic foods to Arabs.

That's some weighty food for thought!

[Sword of Geddon]

Well when the sharia law police come knocking at the door don't say we didn't warn you...

[Rte66]

Sword said:

Well when the sharia law police come knocking at the door don't say we didn't warn you...

Jesus came at a time when the Romans were in control of Judah. I wonder why? Why not come in at a time when Judah was powerful and in control of their own land?.......maybe to show us that in whatever circumstances we find ourselves in, it is in God we put our faith and trust for salvation, not the laws or the rulers of the country we live in. Sure I don't want to see what was once primarly a nation of Christians become a nation of Muslims under Sharia law...but offering ethnic foods is not evil....we've been offering Chinese and Hispanic foods for years...why should offering Arab foods scare you so?...Simply because it reminds you that they are coming?..if indeed God lets it go that far? And maybe it will be for our own good as a nation...kinda like a punishment..kinda like what God did to punish His disobedient, willful children in the Old Testament.

We can and should do what we can to keep our laws preserving freedom..that is what is so wonderful about this country, or what used to be wonderful about it as even our ability to make the laws according to the majority is eroding. Yes our grip is slipping but we aren't to hold onto it at the expense of love...for our enemies. We have nothing if we don't have love.

And does it really bother you so much to have a "taste" of the Arab culture? I love the diversity to be found in the human race. We are all made in His image yet we are so different in how our cultures developed. It is so interesting to me to see how others eat and live. Jesus did come for everyone, in all cultures, including the Muslims.


If the Sharia police come knocking I will pray that the Lord hold me up so that I may glorify Him and further His kingdom in the process while I remember the words of Paul:

Phl 1:21 For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain.

No regrets.....well, except maybe that I didn't witness all that I should have.

[Sword of Geddon]

66 in your name...curious...

[bok]

66 in your name...curious...

It winds from Chicago to LA
More than two thousand miles, all the way.
Get your kicks on Rte66.

[Lazarus43]

This Wal-Mart thing isn't nearly as big a problem as Keith Ellison is.

Exactly, but he was legally elected.

Blessings,
Lazarus43

[Lazarus43]

66 in your name...curious...

"Route 66" was a TV series in the early 1960s.

[sheri]

I will repeat my response for bok , rte 66, exit 40, and Lazarus 43--.
THIS IS NOT ABOUT ARABS, IT IS ABOUT ISLAM.

I don't understand the negative comments going on here. What is the purpose of them ? Is there something wrong with people of Arabic decent buying products that are ethnocentric ? When I was a young man I worked in a store that provided heavily for the Jewish community it was centered in. Something wrong with that too ? Cmon folks, this anti islam attitude is lopping over into a racial thing. Where is the luv ?

God Bless

David

O.K... This is not a racial issue because Islam is not a race but a political/social/economical/legal ideology thinly veiled under the name of "religion".

When a major , national chain kow tows to one segment of its population, that is very different than your neighborhood mom and pop store catering to a specific clientel. When a store sells "halal" products and shields the pork from the rest of the store-- those are not actions aimed at "Arabs" but Muslims. Quote: "A walled-off section of the butcher case is devoted to Halal meats, slaughtered in accordance with Islamic law ".

When a store hires a "specialist" to give "sensitivity" training to 650 employees in order not to offend the ultra sensitive Muslims and says ""We're not here to overstep our bounds." that is just opening the door to dhimmitude.

burien1 says:

All the stores in my area have now added mexican food isles. That makes good business sense.

Yes, that makes sense, but that is one aisle or a part of one at most, not a WHOLE store..Does your store offer Latino sensitivity training to it's employees??

Lazarus wrote:

I also know of a store in a that is aimed specifically at providing foods for the Jewish community to buy. Many of its patrons speak Yiddish.

All Arabs are not Islamic, either. Many Arab Christians had lived in the Middle East for centuries and have been forced off their lands by Jewish settlers and migrated to the United States or other countries. Just as some Jews have become Christians, some Muslims have converted to faith in Jesus Christ. A large store with which I am familiar has sections that feature Jewish kosher foods as well as Mexican, Italian or Greek favorites. There is nothing wrong with it.

This store is not catering to Arab Christians! You say "Many Arab Christians have been forced off their land by Jewish settlers". Really? So many of your posts never fail to take a stab at Jews while defending Muslim Palestinians.


Do you not understand the aims of Islam is to infiltrate all areas of society, politics, our legal system (sharia law) ect. until Islam becomes dominate and is able to take over the whole of the world?
You have 3 choices in Islam :
1. Convert .
2. Remain a Christian/ Jew but as a second class citizen , a dhimmi, a slave to Muslims.
3. Or death.

Is this what you want for the future of our Country?


Dearborn has the highest Muslim population in America outside of the Middle East.

Will it become our Kosovo, declaring itself separate from America, a state within a state?

This move by Wal-Mart is just one more chink in the armor of America's freedom and sovereignity!

Don't throw the race card out at me- this is not a racial issue, but one of our very survival as a Christian Nation!

Please read this article on "Sharia Creep":

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=C9A33CD4-88D4-4162-A1C1-6777D90821EC

Author and expert on radical Islam Robert Spencer has been sounding the alarm about “sharia creep” for years at his website DhimmiWatch. In an exclusive interview with FrontPageMag.com, Spencer reflected on whether or not his efforts to warn the public were paying off

"I think we may be getting through to a very small number of people, but Muslim Brotherhood front organizations in the U.S. are still making tremendous headway by portraying these Sharia-creep initiatives as simple matters of civil rights, and playing on fears among public officials, and the public at large, of being seen as racist and bigoted.

It is getting worse, because there is a concerted effort by the MSA's on various campuses and other groups to push Muslim accommodation issues aggressively, but this effort is relatively new. We didn't see it on this scale ten or even five years ago. I think it is a natural outgrowth of the post-9/11 anxiety on the part of government and media not to appear ‘Islamophobic.’ As long as that continues to be a matter for concern, there will be continued accommodation of Muslim practices and Islamic distinctiveness, which only aids and abets the Islamic supremacist agenda.

The idea would be to awaken as many people as possible to what is going on here -- who the groups are that are pursuing this agenda, and what the agenda really is, behind all the talk of ‘hate speech’ and accommodation of cultural practices in the name of multiculturalism and diversity.

And that agenda seems to be everywhere – from the big issues right down to British fish and chips. When it was revealed in late February that a popular British snack food contained traces of alcohol, a Muslim Council of Britain spokesman declared, “Certainly we would find it very offensive to have eaten food with alcohol.”
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I don't want to see the Islamization of America , and neither should you!

WAKE-UP!

This move by Wal-Mart is much more than just having an aisle with a few ethnic foods.!

It is a systematic infiltration of Islam into America with the aim to eventually install Sharia as the law of the land , with Islam reining supreme!



In 1998, CAIR's founder, Omar Ahmad stated:

"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."

This attitude of "multicultural accommodation" towards Muslims expressed here is disturbing!

I suggest you go to:
link remove by acib
and have your eyes opened!

Sheri

[TRUTHSPEAK]

No matter how hard you try Sheri, some people simply won't open their ears or their eyes. Blindness to truth is an unfortunate reality in exact proportion to the days and times we're living in.

Nevertheless, never give up the fight for truth; a tiny mustard seed planted is a watering ground for another.

The Gardener will work the soil.

[sheri]

No matter how hard you try Sheri, some people simply won't open their ears or their eyes. Blindness to truth is an unfortunate reality in exact proportion to the days and times we're living in.

Nevertheless, never give up the fight for truth; a tiny mustard seed planted is a watering ground for another.

The Gardener will work the soil.

and : so much for those words of encouragement...we should never give up on speaking the truth! We who see Islam for what it is need to continuously sound the alarm! And even though at times we may feel we are shouting into the wind, God would want us to keep His light illuminating the dark corners of this world... Jesus Christ is Islam's only hope and salvation, nothing else can turn their hate into love.


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1 Peter 5:8-9 (NIV)


8Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. 9Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings.




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Luke 10:18-19 (NIV)

18He replied, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. 19I have given you authority to trample on snakes and scorpions and to overcome all the power of the enemy; nothing will harm you.




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Luke 11:33 (NIV)

The Lamp of the Body
33"No one lights a lamp and puts it in a place where it will be hidden, or under a bowl. Instead he puts it on its stand, so that those who come in may see the light.




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Ephesians 6:10-17 (NIV)



The Armor of God
10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. 11Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemes. 12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. 13Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. 14Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, 15and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. 16In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. 17Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God

I will continue to fight for truth!
Sheri

[Rte66]

Sword.....you are picking up some bad habits from those folks at Rag's board.... .to be questioning my name in an attempt to discredit me...for shame...For Shame!! What spirit is behind that?

Just FYI, I "borrowed" the idea for the Rte66 handle from David Jeremiah of Turning Point. He ran a campaign to encourage people to get back into reading the Bible...the Bible being the Route with 66 books?...Get it?

Besides I wanted something short to type and it had the double meaning with the road and the old tv series.

And folks, don't go gettin' your knickers in a twist because I brought up David Jeremiah and tryin' to discredit me with the fact I brought him up. I know some believe he promotes New Age beliefs. The point is I liked the name as it represents the route of the Bible as the way to go through life.


Sheri and the rest, I am perfectly aware of the threat of Islam..I know the Mosques that are being built here...I know the influence the Arab League has over our public school curriculums. I Know the encroachment...no reason to live in fear I say and to deny them their ethnic foods in a country that is essentially made up of a large diversity of people. Maybe we should return to Native American fare if we want to be fair to all the immigrants?..not favoring some ethnic foods over others?

Again I repeat...offering Arab food that happens to be a favorite of many Muslims and an enjoyment to those who like to experiment with flavors from other cultures is not evil. What a way to make folks feel unwelcome, but I guess that would be the goal to prevent America from being Muslimized. Are Muslims our enemies...YES they are. Did not God say we are to love our enemies? But I guess our precious America is more important to some then living the commandment of love.

Now as my sarcastic nature is coming out I will have to refrain from posting on this thread anymore.

[TRUTHSPEAK]

ethnicity, ethnicity, ethnicity, ethnicity, ethnicity, ethnicity...

multicultural, multicultural, multicultural, multicultural, multicultural, multicultural...

babel, babel, babel, babel, babel, babel...

tolerance, tolerance, tolerance, tolerance, tolerance, tolerance...

choice, choice, choice, choice, choice, choice...

babel, babel, babel, babel, babel, babel...



And the Mystery Woman beckons, beckons, beckons, beckons, beckons, beckons...


And the point?

That's just it; there is no point

Except CONFUSION

Satan loves it when God's Children are -CONFUSED

[sheri]

RTE 66:

Sheri and the rest, I am perfectly aware of the threat of Islam..I know the Mosques that are being built here...I know the influence the Arab League has over our public school curriculums. I Know the encroachment.....no reason to live in fear I say and to deny them their ethnic foods in a country that is essentially made up of a large diversity of people. Maybe we should return to Native American fare if we want to be fair to all the immigrants?..not favoring some ethnic foods over others?

YOU JUST DON'T GET IT....I PRAY THAT SOMEDAY YOU WILL....

Sheri

[mouserpg]

I have no problem with arabic food. I have a problem with Halaal/Halal food. This food is food sacrificed to idols. This is the same food being sold at wal-mart. So you can be sure I have a problem with it. I don't want to bring home "allah-blessed" food. I've already found that food in my house and we threw it away.

[not there yet]

Truthspeak,

Am I confused? I simply reject the notion that America is the divine hand of God. I reject the belief that it is our job as a people or as a nation to defend the plan of the God of creation. It is our job to serve the Lord. It is our job to honor, praise Him and preach the Gospel in prosperity, poverty, persecution or even in subjugation. It is our job to submit to Sovereign God, the Creator of all, the One that knows the future and orchestrates the affairs of men. And that submission supersedes the love of a nation, a way of life, a culture, or a society.

So if believing these things makes me confused, blinded, or foolish...then I am the most confused, blind fool that has ever walked the planet and I wouldn't have it any other way. If believing these things makes me weak, then I will have to depend upon the strength of my King.

[Lazarus43]

I have no problem with arabic food. I have a problem with Halaal/Halal food. This food is food sacrificed to idols. This is the same food being sold at wal-mart. So you can be sure I have a problem with it. I don't want to bring home "allah-blessed" food. I've already found that food in my house and we threw it away.

I was not aware of exactly what foods were "Halal." Actually "Halal" is very similar to "kosher" and some Muslims see no difference. Others will not eat foods labeled "kosher." Some Jews will eat Halal certified food, and some Jews will not.

I searched to find a primary source that was trustworthy as to what foods were "Halal."

I quote an excerpt from the website of "Islamic Services of America" for discussion purposes only:

What is Halal?

In Islam, Halal is an Arabic term meaning “lawful or permissible” and not only encompasses food and drink, but all matters of daily life.

The following is a partial list of Halal non-meat products:

* Bread products
* Cereals – breakfast, natural and organic
* Cheese and cheese products and coatings
* Coffee mixes
* Dairy Products – whipped toppings and drink mixes
* Desserts – cakes and pastries
* Eggs – powdered, frozen, and processed
* Fish and Seafood
* French fries and Processed Potatoes
* Fruits – fresh and/or dried
* Grains
* Honey
* Ice Cream / Ice Cream Toppings
* Jams and Jellies



* Legumes and Nuts
* Milk (from species considered Halal)
* Pastry Items – frostings and coatings
* Pastas
* Peanut Butter
* Pizzas
* Plants (which are non-intoxicating)
* Sauces and dressings
* Seasonings
* Soup and Soup Base
* Syrups – table and flavored
* Tea Blends
* Vegetables – fresh and frozen

Link.

The rest of the web page explains about a few more aspects of Halal meat. While I think the apostle Paul would not be afraid to eat it, he did write:

1Cr 8:4 Therefore concerning the eating of things sacrificed to idols, we know that there is no such thing as an idol in the world, and that there is no God but one.
1Cr 8:5 For even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords,
1Cr 8:6 yet for us there is {but} one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we {exist} for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we {exist} through Him.
1Cr 8:7 However not all men have this knowledge; but some, being accustomed to the idol until now, eat {food} as if it were sacrificed to an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.
1Cr 8:8 But food will not commend us to God; we are neither the worse if we do not eat, nor the better if we do eat.
1Cr 8:9 But take care that this liberty of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak.

Also from the "Islamic Services of America" web page:

...For Halal meat and poultry processing, the Muslim slaughterman is required to acknowledge God's Creation and to thank God for providing sustenance by stating a prayer before each and every slaughter...

I think Halal slaughtered meat would be best not eaten based on not wanting to "somehow become a stumbling block to the weak." Other Halal foods should not be a problem.

Blessings,
Lazarus43

[sheri]

APPEASING ISLAM by Pat Condell

While a little too strident for me, he speaks the truth. It may be too late for Europe, but if we become educated to the danger of "creeping sharia", we may be able to stave off Islamification of America and, by the grace of God, remain the last bastion of hope in this crazy world !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9dXGJ2rYdA

[Operator]

Truthspeak,

Am I confused? I simply reject the notion that America is the divine hand of God. I reject the belief that it is our job as a people or as a nation to defend the plan of the God of creation. It is our job to serve the Lord. It is our job to honor, praise Him and preach the Gospel in prosperity, poverty, persecution or even in subjugation. It is our job to submit to Sovereign God, the Creator of all, the One that knows the future and orchestrates the affairs of men. And that submission supersedes the love of a nation, a way of life, a culture, or a society.

So if believing these things makes me confused, blinded, or foolish...then I am the most confused, blind fool that has ever walked the planet and I wouldn't have it any other way. If believing these things makes me weak, then I will have to depend upon the strength of my King.

If I'm reading your posts correctly, to sum it all up - IMO - you are saying that we shouldn't stand in the way of God's plan...let it all roll out - let it happen. Correct? If so, that's like saying that we shouldn't vote because God has a plan and whatever is going to happen will happen no matter what - because it's God's plan. I kind of have a problem with that. I don't think we should sit back and do nothing. But again - that's just my opinion.

[Rte66]

I know I said I'd not post again...my feathers were a bit ruffled last night...and I felt my anger getting the best of me.

Thank you, Sheri, for your prayers.



To address the issue of halal foods....its no different than what Paul said about meat sacrificed to idols as Lazarus pointed out. If it bothers your conscience..don't eat it...if it doesn't bother your conscience, eat it privately if you like it so much for the sake of your brother. It would be the compassionate thing to not eat of it in his presense. If a business wants to go to the trouble of providing halal foods to Muslims...that is the American way... capitalism at work. If there were no market for it where they could make a profit they wouldn't bother.

I mentioned (in not so many words) in a post above that as Americans we should do what we can to ensure, by the voting process, equality, liberty and fairness for all. For some reason (probably many reasons, actually)that concept has flown out the window and certain groups, special interests, etc who happen to scream the loudest seem to get their way. And yes it does seem that the Muslims are having it their way in this country in many respects as are the homosexuals. I don't argue that point. It does make a person wonder...how has it come to this? And if God has allowed it to come to this point...there must be good reason why it is in His will because even though Satan may be behind the Muslim religion and its progression, God is ultimately allowing that to happen, is He not?

Another thing...it doesn't surpise me that America has come to this. As much as this country was founded as a Christian nation, it was not written into the Constitution that America would always remain a Christian nation. The founding fathers wanted to get away from state instituted religion. Sure, many states had requirements for individuals to be Christian in order to serve in government at first..but those were states rights and when the Fed steps in, states rights are trumped. We cannot get back the America we once had by legislation no matter how hard we try and how much we want it because the America that existed then was in the hearts of the people. It was the intentions of their hearts that were manifested in the laws. We must get Christ back in the hearts of the people in order to make a change in this country. Once that happens then truth and fairness and liberty will prevail. How does that happen? The Holy Spirit working through us as individual Temples to share His truth and love with the people God brings into our lives; that includes the Muslim next to me in the produce aisle.

[not there yet]

Operator,

No, I'm not saying not to vote. We have an obligation as citizens of this nation to vote and be involved in the political process. But for me, my safety and security does not rest in the outcome of a vote or a national action. God is either in control of He isn't. He either has a divine plan or He doesn't. Scripture either is the authoritative word of God or it isn't.

If we believe that we are in the last 7 years, or even close, why are we concerned about what Wal-Mart is selling? IF...we believe we are that close and we continue to doubt that God really knows what he is doing and it is all dependent upon we humans do to stop the growth of Islam...then I believe we have a bigger problem.

Don't we have more important things to do as the body of Christ?

[TRUTHSPEAK]

Truthspeak,

Am I confused? I simply reject the notion that America is the divine hand of God. I reject the belief that it is our job as a people or as a nation to defend the plan of the God of creation. It is our job to serve the Lord. It is our job to honor, praise Him and preach the Gospel in prosperity, poverty, persecution or even in subjugation. It is our job to submit to Sovereign God, the Creator of all, the One that knows the future and orchestrates the affairs of men. And that submission supersedes the love of a nation, a way of life, a culture, or a society.

So if believing these things makes me confused, blinded, or foolish...then I am the most confused, blind fool that has ever walked the planet and I wouldn't have it any other way. If believing these things makes me weak, then I will have to depend upon the strength of my King.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe I've ever stated that these United States of America (or should I say -Divided?) is the hand of God. It's always been my belief that these Divided States of America is none other than the Mystery Woman herself aka Mystery Babylon The Great, but that's for another -debate.

Of course the "brand" of food an individual eats is not the issue here. It's the fact that Islam (based on the demonic and delusional writings within the Koran) desires that all "infidels" die or submit. Now who are these -infidels? Anybody that has not converted to the Islamic LIE.

Confusion (babel) has come-has been here for quite some time now-upon these Divided States of America; not only due to the Islamic LIE, also due to the Hindu LIE, the Atheist LIE, the Buddhist LIE, the Homosexual LIE, the Abortion LIE, the Great spirit in the sky LIE, the New Age LIE, ad nauseum...

I figure you're a brother or sister in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (a Born Again believer)...

I figure most (if not all) of those who post here on FP are believers in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (Born Again believers)...

And myself? I'm a believer in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (a Born Again believer)...

That makes you, everyone else here at FP, and myself brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus our Lord and Savior (Born Again believers)...

That being said, and as Paul stated once, I don't speak on God's authority here regarding the following, but as a man (a sinner washed in the Precious Blood of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ):

When (not if) the apostate/reprobate man/men or woman/women or both come knocking on my door in an attempt to force my wife, my children, my loved ones to either -submit or die?

Let's put it this way

I'll do anything within my human power to ensure that my wife, my children, my loved ones not be molested in any way shape or form...

But the enemies of my loved ones should be aware of one very important fact: I SHALL BE ASKING THE LORD GOD TO GIVE ME THE STRENGTH AND COURAGE TO TAKE DOWN THOSE WHO WOULD EVEN THINK ABOUT HURTING ONE OF MY LOVED ONES

That's a Constitutional right of mine -2nd Amendment

And I still do believe in that little thing called -ORIGINAL INTENT

So be it

[Sword of Geddon]

God allowed satan and evil to exist, that does mean we shouldn't oppose him and it? Not There Yet

[not there yet]

Sword,

I will be happy to answer your question. Will you do the same with the several questions that I have raised in my posts?

We can, and should without question, oppose Satan and evil as it is defined by scripture. Our opposition, however, should be led by the Spirit not by national agenda or nationalistic views. Did the children of Israel oppose Nebuchadnezzar because they opposed him from a nationalistic or even theological perspective? Did they view him and his empire to be evil? If you will check out this link on Babylonian and Assyrian religions

http://lexicorient.com/e.o/bab-ass_rl.htm

it is easy to understand that they would indeed find this Assyria an evil empire. And they fought against this empire and were continually defeated because of the sins of the people and their leaders. It was not until Cyrus, appointed by God, defeated Assyria and allowed the Jews to return. Cyrus, appears to have been greatly influenced by Zoroaster (do a search and find out what he believed) who would not have been a follower of Jehovah God.

So, the Jews were made captives by what we would call "evil empire" and then allow to return by what we would call an "evil empire". All of their opposition to "evil" could not win the day. It was the plan and actions of God that allowed them to be captive and it was the design and plan of God that they should be returned according to HIS time table.

In my opinion, our obligation is to serve the Lord and preach the gospel of Jesus. Our obligation is to serve the Lord in freedom, captivity, prosperity, poverty, oppression, persecution to the moment that He calls us home. We can fight / oppose Satan and evil under our own power and in our own will....and we will ultimately lose. I've tried to answer your question. Will you now answer the ones from my previous posts?

[not there yet]

Truthspeak,

I think, perhaps you misread part of my post. I never used the word "divided" in referring to the hand of God. I used the word "divine".

I respect your nationalism and your love of your country. I respect your love for the US Constitution. I personally believe that it is the second greatest document ever written.

I am familiar with the term "Original Intent" and many of the beliefs associated with that movement or cause. Can you help me understand what Original Intent has to do with the point that I was making that prompted your reply? Thank you.

[Sword of Geddon]

I know all about that false religion Zoroaster founded, named after him. You would be the kind scripture points out Not There Yet, as one who could have done something about evil but didn't. What if you could make a difference? Would you choose not to because of your belief that "We will lose anyway". You don't know that. I don't believe as Christians that sharing the gospel is the only thing we are supposed to be doing. We are to oppose evils like Homosexuality, the New Ageization of the Church, and the Islamication of America. These are plots of satan not God. Your idea that we should do nothing is like handing over your son to the homosexuals, and your daughter to the islamists. Might as well.

[sheri]

I know all about that false religion Zoroaster founded, named after him. You would be the kind scripture points out Not There Yet, as one who could have done something about evil but didn't. What if you could make a difference? Would you choose not to because of your belief that "We will lose anyway". You don't know that. I don't believe as Christians that sharing the gospel is the only thing we are supposed to be doing. We are to oppose evils like Homosexuality, the New Ageization of the Church, and the Islamication of America. These are plots of satan not God. Your idea that we should do nothing is like handing over your son to the homosexuals, and your daughter to the islamists. Might as well.

I agree with you Sword of Geddon. We have free will, we are not God's puppets, we have choices in this world-- to choose good or evil, to sin or not, to follow God or Satan. God gives us these choices, and he knows which ones we will choose-- He knows the ultimate outcome of our choices. The wages of sin is death and we reap what we sow. Man is born with original sin and a carnal nature that we must always fight against. I don't believe the Holocaust was God's will, but man's evil led by the Antichrist in the form of Hitler. Did it cause the Jews to eventually return to Israel and thus fulfill prophecy? Yes, all things good come from God eventually, but Satan ran that show,and good people, mainly American, prevailed and fought the evil unleashed on the world, and through blood ,sweat, and tears, conquered evil, and were victorious, as we Christians will be with the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, who will wipe away all our tears!

Should we fight evil with all our might? Of course we should, and with God's help, we can defeat it!

Christians have to stop being apathetic and passive. The Holocaust happened because good people chose to do nothing!

not there yet
PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:36 am Post subject:
What if the islamification of the US (no matter how vile it seems to us) is a part of God's ultimate plan? Where is our faith? Is it in our nation and its freedoms or in our Heavenly Father and His sovereign plan?

Not there yet: I am sure that there were many German Christians in 1938 who believed the same way about Nazism....

[not there yet]

Sword,

Was that an answer to my questions?

Sheri,

So then you would say that God only sometimes appoints Kings and Rulers or that God only engages in the affairs of kings and rulers sometimes?

21The LORD said to Moses, “When you go back to Egypt see that you perform before Pharaoh all the wonders which I have put in your power; but I will harden his heart so that he will not let the people go.

Exodus 9:12

19There was not a city which made peace with the sons of Israel except the Hivites living in Gibeon; they took them all in battle. 20For it was of the LORD to harden their hearts, to meet Israel in battle in order that he might utterly destroy them, that they might receive no mercy, but that he might destroy them, just as the LORD had commanded Moses.

Joshua 11:19-20

1And the word of the LORD came to me saying, 2“Son of man, set your face toward Gog of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him 3and say, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD, “Behold, I am against you, O Gog, prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal. 4“I will turn you about and put hooks into your jaws, and I will bring you out, and all your army, horses and horsemen, all of them splendidly attired, a great company with buckler and shield, all of them wielding swords; 5Persia, Ethiopia and Put with them, all of them with shield and helmet; 6Gomer with all its troops; Beth-togarmah from the remote parts of the north with all its troops—many peoples with you.

Ezekiel 38:1-6

1Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.
Romans 13:1

And we still have the references to Nebuchadnezzar and Cyrus that I listed in my earlier post.

Is he God or is He not? Or is He only sometimes God? Or is He only God when a nation claims Him in victory? Or is He only God when we approve of His choice of leaders or victors? Or is He only God when we like the outcome of a war, or a military action, or a political election?

We will just have to agree to disagree on this one.

[sheri]

not there yet wrote:

We will just have to agree to disagree on this one.

Yes we will-- people have been debating God's will VS. man's free will forever and I don't think we'll solve it on this thread but....

ISLAM IS STILL AN EVIL SATANICLY INSPIRED "RELIGION" AND WE STILL NEED TO FIGHT AGAINST EVIL WHEREVER WE FIND IT.



Ephesians 6:10-17 (NIV)



The Armor of God
10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. 11Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemes. 12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. 13Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. 14Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, 15and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. 16In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. 17Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God .

SHERI

[TRUTHSPEAK]

Truthspeak,

I think, perhaps you misread part of my post. I never used the word "divided" in referring to the hand of God. I used the word "divine".

I respect your nationalism and your love of your country. I respect your love for the US Constitution. I personally believe that it is the second greatest document ever written.

I am familiar with the term "Original Intent" and many of the beliefs associated with that movement or cause. Can you help me understand what Original Intent has to do with the point that I was making that prompted your reply? Thank you.

not there yet, I didn't misread any part of your post; forgive me if I was vague, often times my thoughts work faster than my hands can type:

There is ONLY ONE DIVINE HAND OF GOD -God's RIGHT HAND (Jesus The Christ).

I used the word "divided" to place emphasis on the utterly pathetic and politically correct (everything's relative) cancer which has turned We The People of these United States of America into a psychotic pack of ethnic backgrounds and cultural and religious beliefs; the psychosis runs deep, and We The People are being consumed from the inside out by the millions -nay, tens of millions -nay, hundreds of millions of "voices, voices, voices..." There are so many beliefs/opinions that God's still small voice can't be heard above the wolves deafening howls, and the sheep are nearly ate up by Satan's malignant minions (wolves in sheep's clothing.) And Islam for one is stocked full of wolves working for Satan (the head wolf) the father of LIES. And the Christian "religion" is stocked full as well.

No, these United (Divided) States of America most certainly are not the Divine Hand of God.

I hope I've been a little more transparent, more clear on that particular point.

With that said?


We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain. (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.) Giving no offence in any thing, that the ministry be not blamed: But in all things approving ourselves as the ministers of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses, In stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults, in labours, in watchings, in fastings; By pureness, by knowledge, by longsuffering, by kindness, by the Holy Ghost, by love unfeigned, By the word of truth, by the power of God, by the armour of righteousness on the right hand and on the left, By honour and dishonour, by evil report and good report: as deceivers, and yet true; As unknown, and yet well known; as dying, and, behold, we live; as chastened, and not killed; As sorrowful, yet alway rejoicing; as poor, yet making many rich; as having nothing, and yet possessing all things. O ye Corinthians, our mouth is open unto you, our heart is enlarged. Ye are not straitened in us, but ye are straitened in your own bowels. Now for a recompence in the same, (I speak as unto my children,) be ye also enlarged. Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty. (II CORINTHIANS 6)

Truthspeak,

Am I confused? I simply reject the notion that America is the divine hand of God. I reject the belief that it is our job as a people or as a nation to defend the plan of the God of creation. It is our job to serve the Lord. It is our job to honor, praise Him and preach the Gospel in prosperity, poverty, persecution or even in subjugation. It is our job to submit to Sovereign God, the Creator of all, the One that knows the future and orchestrates the affairs of men. And that submission supersedes the love of a nation, a way of life, a culture, or a society.

So if believing these things makes me confused, blinded, or foolish...then I am the most confused, blind fool that has ever walked the planet and I wouldn't have it any other way. If believing these things makes me weak, then I will have to depend upon the strength of my King.

I can't possibly disagree with you on these TRUTHS; however, I'm very wary when, as believers in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and therefore brothers and sisters (literally), we all (myself included) bicker like ordinary siblings, when in fact we're to follow II CORINTHIANS 6, when in fact we don't belong to this world and the wolves howling voices, when in fact we're to completely and utterly: come out from among them, and be ye separate... When in fact we're not ordinary worldly people, but God's adopted sons and daughters.

Yes, personally speaking of course, I've always been a very patriotic person, sometimes carrying it just a little overboard; nationalism has the smell of rotting Fascism in this post World War II world. Nevertheless, patriotism within the bounds of our forefathers Original Intent is, at least on this worldly plane of existence, both healthy and moral.

I can understand, empathize, and support those who believe these United (Divided) States of America may have just one more chance to repent as a nation, to repent of our individual, family, state and national sin/s. And then turn our spiritual/moral clocks back somewhere around the turn of the 20th Century. We The People either do this -Get back to the Original Intent of our Founding Fathers or ... We're doomed as a nation.

not there yet, I don't believe you're any more confused, blinded or foolish than the rest of us (myself included.) Living in this sin sick society, everyday coming in contact with the demonic depravity all around us, it's a wonder that we're not all babbling (babel) wolves; only God's mercy -only God's Grace has kept us.

It can't be much longer now, not much longer before our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ splits those eastern skies, for if He doesn't come soon?

Even the very elect would be deceived, and we know that's simply ... not possible. ?



God Bless you and yours not there yet



PS - I'm "not there yet" either

[sheri]

AHhhh ...someone else who agrees with me:



http://theopinionator.typepad.com/my_weblog/2008/03/walmart-opens-h.html

WALMART OPENS HALAL-MART IN DEARBORNISTAN
Well looks like Walmart, the world's largest retailer, has decided that ethnocentric pandering is the way to go in what once was the "melting pot" of America. The United States of America's successful centuries old melting pot of immigrants has, in recent years, turned into nothing more than a "chunky soup". Now it looks like "America's store" is furthering the balkanization of the United States - all in the name of profit.
Walmart has decided to go full tilt into setting up the latest in its ethnocentrically targeted stores in Dearborn Michigan - whose mushrooming Islamic population has caused many to rename the city - Dearbornistan. Not only do many of the staff, of this big box store, speak Arabic - but the 650 employees are receiving "sensitivity training" how to best appease the muslim customers - also known as dhimmitude.
With such major help from this greedy international corporation, already accused of lowering wages and forcing thousands of American jobs overseas, is their sefish combination of pandering and profits going to become the downfall of Americanization? - Is this what the "new" America is becoming? Shall we soon be the Balkanized States of America? Do we really want or need a 20,000 sq. ft. giant retail store that is "akin to a farmers market in Beirut"?

Read the comments too....