Herb-Daniel's 70th week

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Postby perigrini on Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:36 am

God seeks common people with uncommon commitment.
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Postby Abiding in His Word on Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:21 am

perigrini wrote:God seeks common people with uncommon commitment.


:a3: and I might add obedience......
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Postby DeLila on Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:30 am

If the tribulation had begun, wouldn't we know for sure who the antichrist is? No one answered my question, who is it?
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Postby perigrini on Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:41 am

DeLila wrote:If the tribulation had begun, wouldn't we know for sure who the antichrist is? No one answered my question, who is it?

The answer is likely no.

3 Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction,
4 who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God.
2 Thessalonians 2:3-4

This passage is talking about the "man of lawlessness", which is the antichrist and his being revealed. It appears to connect his being revealed with taking his seat in the temple of God.

That event is mentioned elsewhere in scripture, such as here...


15 "Therefore when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),
Matthew 24:15

Jesus is referencing Daniel here.

The common understanding of these passages is that the antichrist will declare himself god in the temple of God...which is why many are keeping an eye to the rebuilding of a temple in Jerusalem.

This is to happen in the middle of the 70th week...so if the 70th week began then the revelation of the antichrist won't be certain until about 3 1/2 years later when he claims to be god.

Blessings,

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Postby Abiding in His Word on Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:56 am

Great clarification, Peri. Thanks!
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Postby davis5454 on Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:04 am

OOPS .....error
Last edited by davis5454 on Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby davis5454 on Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:06 am

perigrini wrote:"Therefore when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),
Matthew 24:15


Perigrini - you stole my thunder....That's the quote I was going to use for Jereome. If the AOD was still to come when Matthew wrote - it couldn't have been Antiochios Epiphanies (sp?) since he was about 100 years before Jesus came and before the gospel of Matthew was written.

Jereome - i'll answer your stuff later tonight after I get home.

BD
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Postby ClutchforChrist on Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:51 am

I like to to try to prove this is not the 70th week, and so far I can't do it. Until I do, I am going to live as if this is the 70th week. What will really pin it down for a lot of people is when a comprehensive peace is ironed out in the Middle East. Of course, we all won't know for sure until the AofD.

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Postby bok on Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:46 pm

DeLila wrote:If the tribulation had begun, wouldn't we know for sure who the antichrist is? No one answered my question, who is it?


It is a common mistake to think that the "Tribulation" is the entire 70th week. It is not. In fact, the tribulation does not begin until the middle of the 70th "seven".
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Postby davis5454 on Mon Mar 05, 2007 4:28 pm

OK Jereome - I give. I can't discuss things with you logically if you keep changing your positions.

You said yourself:
Im not die hard fan on the belief that the first seal starts the 70th week,


You also said:
Now since not a single person here can point to a single seal being opened then no we arent in the 70th week.



Dude...you're all over the board with this stuff...

    You say the seals are a sign that the tribulation has started.
    You say the tribulation doesn't have to start with the beginning of the 70th week.
    And you say that because we haven't seen the broken seals that we can't be in the 70th week.

There's no continuity in the way you think. You can't have it all ways.

I used to take alot of your view until a very gifted preacher opened my eyes made me think about what was written in the scriptures without assmuing what others had taught first.

When I actually stopped and looked at what this preacher was saying, I didn't agree totally with him on every point...but he seemed to have a better understanding of what the scriptures say than most.

One thing I noticed is that you said:
The best way to interprete end times prophecy is that for the most part its sequential.

i.e. 7 seals ---> 7 trumpets ---> 7 vials ---> second coming ---> Millenial Kingdom etc...



Did you realize that you TOTALLY left something out !?!?!?
Most people never see it and books don't talk about it.
People overlook it or change the meaning completely...
That's what got me looking closer and made me realize that people were likely making revelation fit their views instead of the other way around.

So what is it that's missing?

What about the Angels???

Try this:
Put the first 6 seals by the 6 angels

Notice the 7th seal is 7 trumpets and there is not a 7th angel - but 7 more angels

Then put the 7 trumpets by the 7 bowls that the angels are pouring out.

Notice the MANY MANY similarities....the deeper you dig, the more you find.

The bible says that in the mouths of two witnesses shall something be established. I believe this is a second view of the same events. The first in heaven / the second is the final results on earth.

Here's a link to my web page with my VERY ROUGH study notes
http://home.comcast.net/~timeswatch/bib ... y_info.htm

The text is color coded to aid in seeing the similarities.

Again, the study is not through and it's VERY rough and not finished.

I've got to run eat dinner...and don't plan on trying to convince you of something you can't keep straight anyway.

But think of this...if the first seal IS the AC or the SPIRIT of the AC....
Then who's to say that Solana or anyone else working on making peace treaties is not the "conquering with peace" that's in the bible.

Wouldn't that be confirmation of the 1st seal in your view?

Nobody said that the horse going forth had to have all the signatures on the paper before he rode....



:typing:
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Postby Triton57 on Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:38 pm

jereome wrote:I said that the seals were the sign to the world that the tribulation has started.

Based upon this scripture:
Revelation 6:
12And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


Big difference.

Now since not a single person here can point to a single seal being opened then no we arent in the 70th week.

You know before I decided to post these posts on this site, my perception of Revelation was that the Tribulation didnt start until around the sixth seal (I was never dogmatic about it mind you) but upon further study, Ill go so far as saying that the Tribulation doesnt start until after the 7 seals, a good time would probably after the 30 minutes of silence in Heaven.

Jerome, how do you define "great tribulation?" It seems you associate it with God's wrath. Do you have a scripture that associates that term with God's wrath?
Phillip
2 Timothy 4:1-4
“About the time of the end, a body of men will be raised up who will turn their attention to the Prophecies, and insist upon their literal interpretation, in the midst of much clamor and opposition.” - Sir Isaac Newton (1642-1727)
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Postby david on Tue Mar 06, 2007 12:53 am

I’ve been following this post and the discussion with Jerome is quite interesting. What’s great about this place is people can civilly disagree with out it getting out right rude and I applaud all of you for sticking to your points with out succumbing to any insults or nasty’s.


Jerome:
With that said I can see where davis5454 is coming from and at the same time I am trying to understand you. This all appeared to start when Jerome rebutted hirutbuddy then had an exchange with Herb then WhiteH2OWoman then davis5454 then Triton57 chimed in.

Now granted when you come to a place like FP you will find people that think a lot alike, that does not necessarily make what anyone here says is correct just because we think a like. But when you have this many people clearly pointing out some issues with what you are posting you should really take time to consider what is being said.

You are spending your time attempting to debunk other people’s positions rather than posting what you believe yourself. ( Just to note I did see some of your positions but again most is just rebuttle.)

But I could not just let it lay there I need to give my own rebuttal. This whole thing started with this one point.

Jerome I believe you did not give WhiteH2OWoman an adequate answer to her comment,

"WhiteH2OWoman said"

Jerome, you've contradicted yourself. On the one hand, you said:
jereome wrote:


Not true, you will know when the time period for the last week has started when the 7 seals are opened.



I did not see a clear answer on your part. Jerome please answer the following question with a short yes or no.

Is it possible for the “last week” to start before the first seal is opened?

If your answer is no then please quote a scripture to back it up.

Jerome you do really have a lot in place from what I can see and well I think if you scratched a little deeper you would find what some of the others are talking about.

As for davis5454 last post he has a very good point; you are contradicting yourself. And Jerome I don’t want to hear you respond with well you misinterpreted me or assumed…

with much love

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

davis5454 if you do not get a straight answer or acknowledgement you should give up on him. But then there would be no drama to watch.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TO: Triton57

I really appreciated your post on may 5th where you quoted Rev. and Daniel. That was a good piece of work that put things into perspective.



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Postby davis5454 on Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:58 pm

David,

Thanks for all the kind words to everyone.

I pretty much decided to stop with the posts last night....
My reply was just me stating my final point and letting it go.

I've learned that sometimes (not necesserily saying it's the case here) but sometimes, people are more than willing to debate a point as long as they don't have to give up any ground.

The more I learn....the more I realize I don't know....
The more I realize I don't know....the more I learn....

I miss being young and knowing it all !!! :cry:


BD
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Postby David L on Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:35 pm

DeLila wrote:Who is the antichrist?


Britney Spears..


bok wrote:
DeLila wrote:If the tribulation had begun, wouldn't we know for sure who the antichrist is? No one answered my question, who is it?


It is a common mistake to think that the "Tribulation" is the entire 70th week. It is not. In fact, the tribulation does not begin until the middle of the 70th "seven".


That is, the great tribulation, no where in the scripture does it imply that the great tribulation is a 7 year period but many would agree that the second half of the 3 1/2 years is worse than the first, therefore, it would be more accurate to imply that the second half is the great(er) tribulation...
Last edited by David L on Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby AndCanItBe on Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:49 pm

Britney Spears..


:rolllaughing:

Only according to Britney Spears, I suspect. :wink:
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Postby David L on Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:51 pm

Are you questioning my sources!! :mrgreen:
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"Thus says the Lord GOD, 'This is Jerusalem; I have set her at the center of the nations, with lands around her. Ezekiel 5:5
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Postby DeLila on Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:05 am

LOL Britney Spears
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