40 days of purpose???

[bertienesbitt]

http://www.saddlebackresources.com/en-U ... erview.htm

has anyones church been doing this?? i was told last night that my old church is starting this, after i told them the dangers of the purpose driven teachings....now today i was given a invite for it by my parents, after me warning them about it.... what to do? is my question....

[smallisland]

Hey Bertie I just noticed where you come from. Have you ever visited the website of Chris Perver? Its called Prophecy in the news. He also comes from NI - he writes some good articles.

[Abiding in His Word]

has anyones church been doing this?? i was told last night that my old church is starting this, after i told them the dangers of the purpose driven teachings....now today i was given a invite for it by my parents, after me warning them about it.... what to do? is my question....

Hi bertienesbitt,

Aren't you feeling free to respectfully decline their invitation?

[chatty-kathi]

Bertie,

Do not go. Rick Warren is teaching a false social, ecumenical gospel that includes New Age teachings (that we are God). From the free e-book, In The Name of Purpose, http://www.inthenameofpurpose.org , we read:

On CNN Larry King Live, 12/2/05, Rick Warren said:

“I have known many people who believe in the Messiah of Jesus, regardless of what religion they are, because they believe in him. It’s about a relationship, not a religion.”

From the U.N. Interfaith Prayer Breakfast, 9/05, Warren said:

“I’m not talking about a religion this morning. Okay? You may be Catholic or Protestant or Buddhist or Baptist or Muslim or Mormon or Jewish or Jain, or you have no religion at all. I’m not interested in your religious background. Because God did not create the universe for us to have religion. He came for us to have a relationship with him.”

From Warren’s book, Purpose Driven Life on page 34, Warren said:

One day you will stand before God, and he will do an audit of your life, a final exam, before you enter eternity.… God won’t ask about your religious background or doctrinal views."

Again, from Aspen Ideas Festival, The Aspen Institute, July 6, 2005, “Discussion: Religion and Leadership,” with David Gergen and Rick Warren, http://www.aspeninstitute.org/site/c.hu ... Agenda.htm , Warren said:

“I happen to know people who are followers of Christ in other religions.”

Do you catch the ecumenical lie here? Yes, God wants to have a relationship with us. But he’s revealed there is only one way, which only Christianity teaches, through the doctrine of Christ revealed in our Bibles. All other religious systems contain works. Christians are saved by grace alone:

John 14:6, Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. I John 5:12, He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. 2 John v. 9, Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and Son. Ephesians 2:8, 9, For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The reason we are saved by God’s grace and not our works is revealed throughout the Bible because we are totally corrupt. Romans 3:10 says, As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

He covers us with His righteousness when we believe in Him (because only He could pay our sin debt) and repent.

Rick Warren said in Purpose Driven Life, pg. 89:

“Use breath prayers throughout the day, as many Christians have done for centuries. You choose a brief sentence or a simple phrase that can be repeated to Jesus in one breath”.

In Mt. 6:7, we are told, “But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do”…Breath, or centering prayers, are used in the New Age Movement to silence the mind. It is repetition that brings one into an altered state of consciousness.

In Purpose Driven Life, pg. 88, Warren states:

“The Bible says, He rules everything and is everywhere and is in everything”.

And in the Foundations course at Warren’s Saddleback Church, in the “Foundation’s Participant’s Guide” under the section heading “A Fresh Word” (fresh is a key New Age word), Warren says:

"The fact that God stands above and beyond his creation does not mean he stands outside his creation. He is both transcendent (above and beyond his creation) and immanent (within and throughout his creation)”.

Alice Bailey, New Age Prophetess, said that the “Path to God” will be based on “…a fresh orientation to divinity and to the acceptance of the fact of God Transcendent and of God Immanent within every form of life. These are the foundational truths upon which the world religion of the future will rest”. In order to get this rendering, Warren used 15 different Bible versions, including the awful paraphrase, The Message, in PDL, allowing him to choose those that fit into his teachings. In the King James Version, Colossians 1:16, 17, this verse reads:

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him. And he is before all things, and by him all things consist". It does not say God is in all things, only that he created all things and that because of Him, they exist (consist).

God warns us about this very thing. God's wrath is revealed in Romans 1:25 against those "Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever".

Again from PDL, Chap. 3, Warren quoted New Age author Dr. Bernie Siegel. In “Prescriptions for Living” and “How to Live Between Office Visits”, Siegel said, “God is in everyone and everything”. The reference is Eph. 4:6 from a paraphrase, the New Century Version. In KJV, it reads, “One God and Father of all, who is above all and through all, and in you all,” and refers to believers, who partake of the Holy Spirit.

Warren endorses and quotes many New Age authors on his website. I am only scratching the surface. It isn’t just what he says in PDL but all that he teaches, quotes, and endorses.

[bertienesbitt]

All honestly i am tore between to things..to go r not to go? I heard the pastor rick warren speak about faith through jesus..and salvation through him..he sounded sincere about his walk with God..i am so so confused..wolf in sheeps clothes?? Lord help me understand

[chatty-kathi]

Bertie,

The truth is always mixed in with lies in a false belief system. What you are saying is that Rick Warren sounds orthodox.

The biggest test is whether Rick Warren is teaching the true gospel, or the new “gospel of easy believism”, which does not contain the necessary information for someone to believe but relies on praying a prayer, or “making a decision”. Without all the essential elements, it is not the gospel.

From www.atrueandfaithfulwitness.com/40DaysJesus.htm , we read (emphasis added):

What Didn’t You Do With Jesus?
(A critique of the first session of “40 Days of Purpose” by Rick Warren)

In the first session of Rick Warren’s “40 Days of Purpose” video tape (fall 2003) he says that each one of us will one day stand before God. And standing before Him we will give an account of our lives. At this point God is going to ask us two questions:

1. “What did you do with my Son, Jesus Christ?”
2. “What did you do with what I gave you – what did you do with your life?”

Warren goes on to say that he will help us answer the second question as he takes us through the video sessions ahead. But he really wants us to make sure that the first question is answered correctly by each of us. “Do you have a relationship with Jesus Christ?” He is prepared to lead us in a prayer. He very passionately wants the issue to be settled – that “you are connected to Christ.” He then prays a prayer and congratulates those who prayed. “You’ve just become a part of the family of God.”

As far as can be determined, the first session of the “40 Days of Purpose” video never mentions the following about Jesus Christ, the Son of God:

No mention is made of the fact that Jesus’ Father is holy.
No mention is made of the fact that because Jesus’ Father is holy He will judge our sins.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus is incarnate deity. (“Son” is never explained.)
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus had to die for our sins on Calvary.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus’ blood is the only atonement for sin.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus said there was a place called Hell.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus rose from the dead as the living Lord.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus called people to repent.
No mention is made of the fact that Jesus told His disciples to preach repentance.

It seems to me the most immediate question is – “What makes you think Rick Warren was right when he told us that whoever followed him in his prayer was a part of the family of God when he didn’t mention any of these things about Jesus Christ, the Son of God?”

What did Rick Warren do with Jesus Christ, the Son of God? Might some of you conclude he misrepresented how you come to have a relationship with Him by not mentioning these things?

Taken from http://cicministry.org/commentary/issue80.htm , pgs. 3 & 4, we read (emphasis added, excerpted from The User Friendly Gospel: Warren’s Wide Gate):

…Warren’s book does contain many Biblical truths. Missing, however, are many necessary key truths. Subtracting key issues from the gospel changes its essence.

Warren discusses eternity on day four of his spiritual journey and uses it to introduce his version of the gospel. He tells his forty day pilgrims, “If you learn to love and trust God’s Son, Jesus, you will be invited to spend the rest of eternity with him. On the other hand, if you reject his love, forgiveness, and salvation, you will spend eternity apart from God forever” (Warren: 37). Though he never explains the wrath of God against sin, the blood atonement, or the need for repentance (not in the context of the gospel that is), at least he acknowledges there is a hell. Warren is to be commended for including the possibility of being lost.

Let us consider how he presents the gospel: “If you learn to love and trust God’s Son . . .” It is true that we must love and trust Christ, but this is not how Christ or His apostles presented the gospel. They did not suggest that one has to “learn to love Jesus,” implying that were He just dressed up better He would be more lovable. Here is how Jesus said it, “And after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, ‘The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel’” (Mark 1:14,15). Warren is typical of “deeper life” teachers who teach “easy believism” to enter the Christian life and consider the claims of Christ to be options for those who want to be “world class Christians” (Warren: 297). Warren does not mention repentance until he gets to a chapter called “how we grow” (Warren: 182). Jesus (Mark 1:14, 15), Peter (Acts 2:38), and Paul (Acts 17:30) commanded people to repent as terms of entrance into the kingdom, not as a special teaching for elite Christians. Repentance is part of the Great Commission: “He said to them, ‘Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and rise again from the dead the third day;’ and that repentance for forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem” (Luke 24:46, 47).

Learning to love Jesus (whose person and work is never clearly explained by Warren) sounds so inviting. Repenting in order to flee the wrath of God against sin just doesn’t sell in today’s religious climate. Warren makes another gospel invitation on page 58: “Right now, God is inviting you to live for his glory by fulfilling the purposes he made you for.” Warren makes believing very easy: “all you need to do is receive and believe” (Warren: 58). He asks, “Will you accept God’s offer?” (Warren: 58). After urging his readers to believe God chose them and receive the Holy Spirit for power to “fulfill your life purpose” (Warren 58), he offers a little prayer that will save people. According to Warren, here is how you are saved: “I invite you to bow your head and quietly whisper the prayer that will change your eternity, ‘Jesus, I believe in you and I receive you.” Then he makes this promise, “If you sincerely meant that prayer congratulations! Welcome to the family of God!” (Warren: 59). Say a little prayer and believe in a Jesus whose person and work have not been clearly explained to you and you will be saved, or so Warren says.

This is not the narrow gate that Jesus mentioned in Matthew 7. MacArthur warns about Warren’s sort of teaching, “According to lots of churches and preachers, the answer is to popularize the gospel: get rid of all this slaying-yourself and carrying-your-cross stuff, and get a decent band up there on stage” (MacArthur: 12). This is in a section about the narrow gate. MacArthur continues, “Listening to a seeker-sensitive evangelical preacher today, we’re likely to think it’s easy to be a Christian. Just say these little words, pray this little prayer, and poof! you’re in the club.” (MacArthur: 12). This is exactly what Warren suggested as the gospel, “Pray this little prayer.”

Do you suppose Stephen would have been martyred had he told his audience, “God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life, just say this little prayer and you will find out for yourself”? Here is what Stephen preached: “You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did. Which one of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? And they killed those who had previously announced the coming of the Righteous One, whose betrayers and murderers you have now become; you who received the law as ordained by angels, and yet did not keep it” (Acts 7:51-53). After citing the history of Israel from the Old Testament, Stephen brought his listeners face to face with Messiah and the fact that they had refused to listen to Him. They needed circumcised hearts! (Moses promised a circumcised heart in Deuteronomy 30:6). They needed to be converted by God’s grace and embrace the Messiah they had betrayed. They killed Stephen instead. Stephen is honored in the Bible. He knew nothing of the Warren version of the gospel.

The problem is that the user-friendly gospel is giving people false assurance. MacArthur explains, “People are breezing through those wide, comfortable, inviting gates with all their baggage, their self-needs, their self-esteem, and their desire for fulfillment and self-satisfaction. And the most horrible thing about it is they think they’re going to heaven” (MacArthur: 13). Warren skips many things, including the blood atonement, the doctrine of justification, the wrath of God against sin, a clear presentation of the person and work of Christ, and the need for repentance as part of the gospel. He replaces all these things with a personal journey to find one’s purpose. No wonder millions are entering the broad gate that he offers. Warren claims that we find our true self, MacArthur says that our true self is so wicked and perverted that it must die. MacArthur writes, “But start preaching the true gospel, the hard words of Jesus that call for total and absolute self-denial—the recognition that we’re worth nothing, commendable for nothing, and that nothing in us is worth salvaging—and that’s a lot less popular” (MacArthur 14, 15). What we have is the narrow gate and the wide one, they lead to entirely different destinies.

[brandon]

All honestly i am tore between to things..to go r not to go? I heard the pastor rick warren speak about faith through jesus..and salvation through him..he sounded sincere about his walk with God..i am so so confused..wolf in sheeps clothes?? Lord help me understand

Hey Bertie,

You don't need to read articles about the Purpose Driven Movement. You need to do exactly what the Holy Spirit is leading you to do. You don't need lengthy arguments and multiple sources. You need to be obedient. One of the biggest mistakes I made was spending hours upon hours reading up on Rick Warren and Brian McLaren. Instead of seeking after God prayerfully to just help me discern by His Spirit what I needed to do and not do (He'd already told me not to read PDL) I relied on man and discernment ministries.

Now, if the Holy Spirit is leading you to read up on these people and these movements, then by all means read what He tells you too. Remember that knowledge puffs up unless it is imparted by the Holy Spirit. You are far better off praying and reading scripture than you are reading massive databases of information.

[chatty-kathi]

Brandon said:

Remember that knowledge puffs up unless it is imparted by the Holy Spirit.

Let’s look at this verse in context. I Cor. 8:1-13, v. 1 says, Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth. Verse 7, Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled. Verse 9, But take heed lest by any means this liberty of your’s become a stumblingblock to them that are weak. Verse 10, For if any man see thee which hast knowledge sit at meat in the idol’s temple, shall not the conscience of him which is weak be emboldened to eat those things which are offered to idols. Verse 11, And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died? Verse 13, Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.
The context is the knowledge they possessed was that eating food sacrificed to an idol meant nothing. If they did not balance this knowledge with charity (love, to avoid causing the brother to stumble), they would be demonstrating pride instead of showing sensitivity and love by abstaining. Because they were more mature than their weaker brother, they could become proud, but not if they really love God and their brothers, beause they would not want their brother to stumble. This verse does not teach that all knowledge produces pride.

There are too many verses to list regarding knowledge. I’m going to list just a couple:

Hosea 4:6 says, My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.

Proverbs 1:2-5, To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding; to receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity; to give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion. A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels.

In a previous forum, Bertie was shown that it is God’s Word that is our sole authority, containing the doctrine of Christ for salvation, through the Holy Spirit who convicts us of sin.

This deception is a false gospel that is similar to the true, but is powerless because it does not give the truth about our sinfulness, including deserving hell, God’s provision through His Son, His resurrection, and belief that Jesus is the only way.

That is why this is posted, so that Bertie can see where it falls short based on God’s Word.

[InHim]

Wow, chatty-kathi, you know your stuff. I'm going to re-read all this as it really seems to get to the point concerning the idea of reforming the flesh rather than walking in the spirit.

How about forty days of fasting and prayer, of turning off the TV, how about setting our minds on the true kingdom of God and aligning ourselves with His purpose?

Can we be too heavenly minded to be no earthly good? Not if it is the kingdom of our Father, and we realize that the only thing that matters is our faith working itself out in love, especially to those of the household of faith.

I remember brother KP (of Gospel for Asia) in one of his books commenting on the poverty and hunger in India, and he asked the humanitarians, do you think India's problem is a lack of food? No, it is a spiritual problem. Their religion teaches the worship of rats, which each year eat enough grain to fill a train of boxcars stretching from New York to California.

The light must shine in the darkness, and then those in darkness will see if they choose to do so, the light of the glory of God in the face of Christ shining and revealed by the Holy Spirit in their hearts.

[InHim]

This is not the narrow gate that Jesus mentioned in Matthew 7. MacArthur warns about Warren’s sort of teaching, “According to lots of churches and preachers, the answer is to popularize the gospel: get rid of all this slaying-yourself and carrying-your-cross stuff, and get a decent band up there on stage” (MacArthur: 12). This is in a section about the narrow gate. MacArthur continues, “Listening to a seeker-sensitive evangelical preacher today, we’re likely to think it’s easy to be a Christian. Just say these little words, pray this little prayer, and poof! you’re in the club.” (MacArthur: 12). This is exactly what Warren suggested as the gospel, “Pray this little prayer.”

I need to add this here, the works of the flesh are just that, the works of the flesh.

It is the flesh itself that cannot inherit the kindom of God, that profits nothing, that by the works of the law cannot be justified.

It is the flesh itself, the mind set on the flesh, that must go on the cross. For until we die, and fix our eyes on the things above where we are seated with Christ, and we can say with Paul that we will rather boast in our weaknesses for then the power is of God and not of oursleves, until we can say it is Christ in me, the hope of glory that sustains us....

[shieldwolf]

Haven't been by the forum lately, missed this thread. I found a great rebuttal to 40DOP at:
http://www.erwm.com/RWFirewall1.htm
http://www.erwm.com/RWFirewall2.htm
http://www.erwm.com/RWFirewall3.htm
http://www.erwm.com/RWFirewall4.htm

The author spent more time than I could in refuting obvious errors in tricky Rickies teaching. Get all four files and take them with you to the meetings. Start asking questions that confront and bring people back to the Word. One of two things will happen, either people will realize that Rick is a false teacher and needs to be shelved permanently or they will ask you not to return.

God bless your efforts.

Wolf