BREAKING NEWS - AYATOLLAH REVOLTS IN IRAN

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BREAKING NEWS - AYATOLLAH REVOLTS IN IRAN

Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:13 pm

BREAKING NEWS - AYATOLLAH REVOLTS IN IRAN

Breaking news - Saturday (PST) - After Midnight Sunday - Tehran time (TT)

LATEST UPDATE - all phones in the area of the Ayatollah's house have been disconnected and his numbers, which worked till just now have a recording saying "they never existed".


Monitored from live communication with Iran and the Ayatollah Boroujerdi himself by Voice of Iran Radio (KRSI) and local citizens calling in from Tehran to KRSI.

Shots were being fired around the Ayatollah's home at Sard (cold) Park, Avesta Avenue, Sard Street #9 close to Freedom Square. Fires are springing up in the region at major intersections. Ambulance sirens scream futiley as Tehran citizens pour toward that address blocking streets to prevent Security forces from getting close but also blocking the paramedics and ambulances.

Distress calls from wounded men and women fill the air waves as what they describe as total war is erupting. KRSI, which covers all of Iran, constantly broadcasts calls for the populace to rise up, urging them to make the most of this opportunity.

Said Ghayem-Maghami, the announcer of KRSI repeatedly urges all provinces, cities, professions to revolt against the current regime. He also broadcasts live all suggestions provided by Tehran citizens to wake everyone up and let them know something is up.

Ayatollah Boroujerdi, blockaded on the roof of his home, has used the phone contact broadcast with KRSI to declare that anyone in the Security forces who respects him as their spiritual source should lay down their arms and not harm anyone.

Other Ayatollahs like Mehdi Haeri have come on live to urge the people not to set gas stations on fire or do other damage as these sugestions phoned into KRSI come from the Security forces agents.

Ayatollah Haeri added that fasting during this crisis in the month of Ramadan is not required, giving the example of the urgency of a house catching on fire compared to a lower urgency of fasting. He insisted that religion and politics has to be separate and that the populace should support the brve efforts of Ayatollah Boroujerdi.

Meanwhile Mohssein Ejai, Minister of Information and Security (MOIS), has promised Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei that he will bring him Ayatollah Boroujerdi's severed head before dawn.

In the first serious clash with the old guard Mullahs, the Hojatieh fringe sect of the Ahmadi-Nejad administration sent security forces around 10 a.m. (Tehran time) Saturday, to arrest Ayatollah Seyed Hossein Kazeymeni Boroujerdi, son of the Ayatollah of the same name, killed by the Khomeini Islamic regime.

His father was so respected by the late Shah of Iran that when questions about religion arose for which the Shah wanted advice, the monarch would drive down to the holy city of Qom to speak to the Ayatollah instead of ordering him to Tehran.

The younger Ayatollah Boroujerdi recently declared that the national Administrative Government of Iran should be separated from the Clerics and become purely secular. Religion and Politics must be separated he said, live on KRSI.

The current Islamic regime's reaction was to issue death warrant for him falsely claiming apostasy by him because he was said by them to have claimed to be the 12th Imam, who disappeared down a well 1300 years ago and will return to redeem the world.

His followers resisted the efforts of the Security Agents sent during the afternoon to capture the Ayatollah and the on-going confrontation has resulted with multiple arrests, estimated by the Ayatollah himself in a live phone interview as being several thousand people. His people, who rushed to protect him also took several security agents hostage, finding bottles of acid in their pockets, intended to disfigure demonstrators.

The mostly foreign, generally Arab national, Bassiji paramilitary forces, whose total role is to suppress any street demonstration and have been recently equipped with over $500 million of equipment and weaponry and appear in both civilian clothes and uniforms, attacked on motorcycles but were repulsed and several of their motorcycles set on fire.

They brought in eight tanker trucks that propel boiling water onto demonstrators but streets were soon blocked and their efforts curtailed. Currently, regime forces have surrounded the area and blocked major access. Clashes at crossroads initially drove security forces back but reinforcements managed to set up a cordon and hold it.

One panicked caller to KRSI at around 2:15 a.m. (TT) screamed that he had been spotted by the regime mercenaries and had been given refuge inside a nearby house but that the agents were kicking in the door. He pleaded with KRSI to give out his name and remind people that he was about to be arrested and might never be seen again.

Several of those wounded and finding refuge in Ayatollah Boroujerdi's house were women. One an Armenian woman, not a Moslem, called on minorities and specially Armenians, to rush to the Ayatollah's support and to come into the streets. Another woman, a baby in her arms, a club in her hand was seen standing guard at Ayatollah Boroujerdi's ready to face anything the regime would throw at her. Including confiscating the bread and food that those at the residence required to break their Ramadan fast.

Calls by Tehranis demanded Ahmad Hossein Khomeini, the Islamic regime founder's grandson and Ayatollah Montazeri, should join in the resistance and defend Ayatollah Boroujerdi. Other calls wanted the late Shah's son Reza Pahlavi to join the fray and call on the West to provide tangible support to his countrymen in their time of need at this moment of opportunity.

Another caller mentioned that every single one of about 300,000 Bahais in Iran had been recently identified and listed, including their addresses, and wondered if this was an indicator that a slaughter of these thorns in the side of the Hojatieh as about to happen. Bahais claim to follow their spiritual leader is the 12th Imam, who has already returned.

Meanwhile, in a dramatic gesture of defiance, Ayatollah Boroujerdi carrying his burial shroud and a sword paces the roof of his home.


Observers and analysts hope that if the resistance can survive through the night, in the morning, people who sleep unaware of what is going on will join the uprising. Some of those woken up at random by phone calls showed very little interest, responding that replacing one Mullah with another gets them nowhere, so why risk their lives.


Link to article
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Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:44 pm

Tehran Police Clash With Supporters Of Outspoken Cleric
Oct 7, 2006
RFE/RL

Several hundred supporters of an outspoken cleric in Tehran, Ayatollah Kazemeyni Boroujerdi, gathered today in the streets around his house to protest what they described as violation of "freedom of religion."

Protesters told Radio Farda that they were trying to prevent the arrest of Boroujerdi by security forces. Boroujerdi advocates the separation of religion from politics.

One of his supporters told Radio Farda that during the past two months there have been several attempts to arrest the ayatollah.

"[Security forces] took away his daughter and 38 others two months ago, they've freed them but they came this morning to take away [Boroujerdi] but the neighbors didn't give in," the man said. "They came again later to arrest him but his supporters have gathered here and will resist. Thank God, we're many, about 2,000 to 3,000."

Iran's ILNA news agency reported that police used tear gas to disperse the protest but protesters resisted by burning tires to counteract the effects of the gas.


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Postby Salty Skipper on Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:46 pm

What does all of this mean? Did Iwantajihad do this? If so, what are the implications? Thanks!

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Postby jesusphreak on Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:49 pm

Salty Skipper wrote:What does all of this mean? Did Iwantajihad do this? If so, what are the implications? Thanks!

Salty


That's exactly what I was wondering.
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Postby sherrimae on Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:57 pm

Wow! Wouldn't it be something if the Iranians could overthrow their government?
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Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sat Oct 07, 2006 8:02 pm

Ayatollah Kazemeyni Boroujerdi has been an outspoken critic of the government and he and his supporters have been getting harrassed for the last few months. I don't know what triggered this uprising yet, but from what I've read elsewhere thousands of his Iranian supporters are surround his house to protect him.
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Postby OneOfTheseDays on Sat Oct 07, 2006 8:03 pm

I wonder if this will actually lead to some changes or is just a short term inconvience for Ahmadinejad...

I'm leaning towards the latter.
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Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sat Oct 07, 2006 8:07 pm

Thats a huge question OneOfTheseDays, which may take days to find out.


There have been uprisings before that were not successful. I don't know if there is anything that would make this one different.
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Postby sherrimae on Sat Oct 07, 2006 8:16 pm

I hope they will be successful this time. I feel sorry for the Iranian people.
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Postby Downpour on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:31 am

(( Interesting, could this have to do with them wanting to take Ayatollah Kazemeyni Boroujerdi, out of the picture??))

Iran election candidates register
By Frances Harrison
BBC News, Tehran

"Registration of candidates standing for election to Iran's local councils and a key body called the Assembly of Experts is due to start.

The assembly chooses Iran's supreme leader and can amend the constitution.

The 15 December polls will determine whether allies of ultra-conservative President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad gain control of these influential bodies.

Candidates still have to be approved by the watchdog Guardian Council, which inspects their Islamic credentials.

The main contest for the Assembly of Experts will probably be between supporters of the moderate former President, Hashemi Rafsanjani, and hardline cleric Ayatollah Taqi Mesbah-Yazdi.

Mr Rafsanjani has yet to confirm his candidacy but he looks likely to stand in order to try to curb the almost complete power of the ultra-conservatives. Ayatollah Mesbah-Yazdi is the ideological inspiration for President Ahmadinejad and is in charge of sending hundreds of Shia clerics abroad to spread Iran's revolutionary brand of Islam.

He is a shadowy and very powerful figure who does not give interviews to foreign journalists. Reformists accuse him of preaching that violence has a role in Islam.

Whoever has the most supporters in the Assembly of Experts will be in a position to choose the supreme leader when Ayatollah Khamanei dies or retires.

The supreme leader is the most powerful man in Iran with unquestioned authority over foreign policy and the future direction of the country.

But the local elections will also be important in gaining control over the grassroots level and building up local support bases before the next presidential elections in three years time.
"
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:52 am

These muslim fanatics give a bad name to all muslims everywhere. :cry:
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Postby brandon on Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:47 am

dynastywarrior4 wrote:These muslim fanatics give a bad name to all muslims everywhere. :cry:


The article is about an Ayatollah in Iran that is proposing a secular government instead of a religious theocracy...basically, he's the best muslim in power in Iran and the authorities over there are working their hardest to arrest him because he's standing up for the moderates.
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Postby 4givenmuch on Sun Oct 08, 2006 7:17 am

I have seen the ousted Ayatollah(Pres?) on TV and apparently he is pro West (at least in words) and there was an underground movement to get him back into power. I am SURE that US and Britain would LOVE this at this point in the game. The signifcance that I see is that he would play right into the "global world game" without missing a beat. And, the rest of the world would be so happy to have Crazy Atomic Tom out of the way they would move the Solana Doctrines :) right along!
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Postby JR on Sun Oct 08, 2006 8:34 am

:popcorn:
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Postby farmboyinthesticks on Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:14 pm

dynastywarrior4 wrote:These muslim fanatics give a bad name to all muslims everywhere. :cry:


"Muslim" gives a bad name to muslims everywhere.
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:59 pm

little harsh?
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Postby Salty Skipper on Sun Oct 08, 2006 1:11 pm

I agree dynastywarrior. There are many muslims, headed for hell, that do not even know what that the koran teaches that every Christian and Jew is an enemy. I would also like to point out, however, that the more moderate muslims are silent on speaking out against terrorism. Are they afraid to speak out? My guess is, "yes."
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Postby MChat on Sun Oct 08, 2006 1:31 pm

Salty Skipper wrote:I agree dynastywarrior. There are many muslims, headed for hell, that do not even know what that the koran teaches that every Christian and Jew is an enemy. I would also like to point out, however, that the more moderate muslims are silent on speaking out against terrorism. Are they afraid to speak out? My guess is, "yes."


I think it's more along the lines of, they know they can't speak out, because they know it's the truth. Islam teaches nothing but hate and discontent for anyone that is not a muslim. Islam is a religion of peace (in theory) only when the entire world has converted to Islam. In reality even countries with governments based on the fundamentals of Islam can't get along... so much for being a "religion of peace."

More like a religion of pieces... as in that's all they find after a muslim "does his duty for allah" and blows himself up taking along as many "infidels" as he can.
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Postby Salty Skipper on Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:03 pm

I guess I was thinking more along the lines of the muslims in the U. S. who don't even attend a mosque or anything, and haven't really been taught the ways of islam. Surely there are at least some. Anyone can call themself a muslim in name only. JMO
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Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:09 pm

I guess that would be a Mino(w)

as in USS Mino(w), eh Skipper?
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:14 pm

well skipper, there brought up not to speak up agaisnt their beiliefs. Again i say, my beilief Jesus will save every good hearted person. He died for everyones sins regardless of who they are, and I truthly beilieve Jesus is the kind of being who will do the richeous thing.

mainly i beilieve cause i want everyone with a good heart to be saved. I know thats so much to ask but ya kno.
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Postby BondservanttoJesus on Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:19 pm

Critical cleric 'arrested in Iran'
From correspondents in Tehran
October 09, 2006
A SENIOR Shiite Muslim cleric who has challenged Iran's system of clerical rule was arrested after his supporters clashed with police outside his house in the Iranian capital, Iranian news agencies reported.

Ayatollah Mohammad Kazemeini Boroujerdi was detained with several supporters, Iran's student news agency ISNA quoted the deputy governor of Tehran, Abdollah Rowshan, as saying.

The Iranian authorities are wary of any challenge, particularly from top clerics, to the system of clerical rule that was established after the 1979 Islamic revolution by revolutionary leader Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini.

More than 200 of Boroujerdi's supporters clashed with police using teargas on Saturday during a protest outside his house, newspapers reported. Some reports said his followers feared the cleric was in imminent danger of arrest.

"All the people, including Boroujerdi, who caused this issue, were arrested," Mr Rowshan, who is in charge of security and political affairs, was quoted by ISNA as saying.


Link to article


Depending on how influential this Cleric is, this could be over or get ugly real soon.



Here is a blog about whats going on that has pictures and a video
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Postby Salty Skipper on Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:24 pm

Dynastywarrior...Jesus will not save every good hearted person, as strange as that sounds.

John 3:16 tells us that "For God so loved the world, that He gave his only begotten Son that whosever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

Jesus also tells us in John 14:6
..."I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

Unless a person accepts Jesus Christ as their Savior they will not go to heaven. Period.

Exodus 20: 3"You shall have no other gods before Me."
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 4:37 pm

skip im glad u know it sounds strange.

Prophets show divine will of god in bible, Jesus can do whatever he wants, and i beilieve he will do the right thing.
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Postby OneOfTheseDays on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:30 pm

He can do whatever he wants, but he can't bring sin into his presence (heaven)....

that's just something he cannot do. We need Jesus to wash us and cleanse our sin. It's that simple.
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:41 pm

hes son of GOD. That kind of gives him say over a lot. I mean he died and came back. He's a G.
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Postby brandon on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:45 pm

Dynasty, only God knows the truly righteous, and no man is truly good in their heart unless they have been reborn through Christ.

6Jesus told him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me. 7If you had known who I am, then you would have known who my Father is.[a] From now on you know him and have seen him!"


You either believe this statement or you do not. If you profess that Christ knows you and has changed your heart forever, than this statement must be true, and if it is true than this means that every man that does not except Christ as Lord and King will be thrown into Hell.

The Bible is the infallible Word of God. You cannot pick and choose what sounds "nice." God is not nice. God is merciful and kind to those who love Him and worship Him, correcting them when they fall off of the path of following Jesus Christ.

He loves every man, but He is also righteous and just, and to Him our good works are like filthy rags. Because of our sinful nature, we deserve God's Holy wrath, but He is merciful and sent His only son to die for our sons, so that those who believe in Him would receive life eternal.

It's hard to swallow, especially if you've been brought up in our wishy washy, lovey-dovey, "it's all good" world. The reality is that any man that does not accept Christ by faith as Lord and Savior, as well as repenting of his sins, will spend eternity in Hell because that is what he deserves.

I do not deserve Christ's love. I've done nothing in my life that would warrant Him, God on earth, to die for my sins. In fact, I was once more evil than the average bear. I led my sister astray, cursed God's name, indulged in every sexual sin imaginable, brought demons into the house via satanic black metal, corrupted others sexually, and a host of other minor (but still death deserving) sins.

Because of my actions, I deserve Hell, and yet, because of God's perfect and merciful love, I have repented of my sins, been redeemed, and am now a light unto the world. Me, an ex-pervert, am sharing the power of Christ with other lost, lonely, wrath-prone sinners.

To say that "every road leads to Rome" spiritually is to second guess and doubt God's perfect ways, which happens to be the very first sin ever committed, the sin of pride.

Pride is thinking that we know better than God. We put our own opinions and ideas before God's.

I know this is a long post, but it's correcting in love. I was a lost sheep once and was found, and desire that others should know the one true God as I do.
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:58 pm

long post yet insightful.

and if it is true than this means that every man that does not except Christ as Lord and King will be thrown into Hell.


Why is God giving me these options?

Kinda like the Iraq Government back when SAddam was in power. Follow him or die/or sent to his underground prisons.

Follow Christ or go to hell. Follow Saddam or die.

I'm trying to find christ man, but I wont accept the damnation of my loved ones. I rather be with them in hell, then watch them suffer. I know this might sound messed up but, meh.

Day by day i look for christ. A couple hours ago, i felt something, then it faded. :cry: [/quote]
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Postby brandon on Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:16 pm

But you have to realize that your family members are making a choice. God gives us the choice to obey or rebel against His perfect commands. Remember, He created you, He knew you even before you were created and desires you to seek His will in your whole life and that you would love Him as He loves you. He gave you free will so you could choose to love Him, because love is a decision and a commitment.

If I choose to rebel against His commands and pursue my own worthless and imperfect desires, I deserve His holy wrath. He's pure and holy in a way we can hardly understand, and because of our sin and our evil, we seperate ourselves from God. His holiness is so perfect that if, right now, He showed Himself to you, you would perish instantly because you have not been cleansed of your sin.

God's given everyone the opportunity to be preached the Good News at least once in their lives, and if they reject it they have nothing but themselves to blame. My sister has rejected Christ, and if she dies tonight, her soul will be thrown into Hell. It would sadden me incredibly, but it's not my choice, it's hers.

You know the truth now and I pray that you accept Christ as your Lord and Savior, that you might know what I and many others have found in our lives: peace and an unending love that surpasses anything ever felt. And then, may you be the light of Christ to your family, so that they may also know Him who loves them.

You aren't on this board because you felt like it. You were on here because you're being drawn to Him.
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Postby 4givenmuch on Sun Oct 08, 2006 7:40 pm

Brandon, I join you in that prayer! :a3:
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Postby 4givenmuch on Sun Oct 08, 2006 7:51 pm

Dynastywarrior4,


Jesus loves you. Just ask Him to reveal the truth and He will.

He might be waiting on you to work in the lives of your family members. You just don't know.

I have witnessed the hardest of hearts make a commitment to the Lord, through prayer and someone like you in their life and loving them to the truth.

Be Warrior4Him!

PS

I almost made the mistake of giving up God for a brother that I loved dearly! I walked away from God for 6 painful, dark, shameful years wondering how God could send my brother to hell. Satan used my fleshly love to rip apart my heavenly inheritance, and I let him.


There is NO other answer. Thankfully, He, has brought me back into the fold. My brother, 20 years later is still lost . . . but at least he is finally realizing he is lost. God is pacient and perfect and most importantly, He has the last word!

Be Warrior4Him!
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Postby crmann on Sun Oct 08, 2006 8:29 pm

Good evening, Dynasty..

An old friend here! Cleveland, the old timer.

Why is God giving me these options?

Kinda like the Iraq Government back when SAddam was in power. Follow him or die/or sent to his underground prisons.

Follow Christ or go to hell. Follow Saddam or die.

I'm trying to find christ man, but I wont accept the damnation of my loved ones. I rather be with them in hell, then watch them suffer. I know this might sound messed up but, meh
.

Dynasty, let me address your concerns here.

Let us look more closely at John 3:16 - 18
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Please understand, Dynasty...

Every person born since Adam's sin has been born condemned already to hell. God loved his people so much that He gave His only begotten Son, Jesus, so that those who are already condemned can believe in Him and be forgiven of their sins so that they are no longer condemned.

God sends no one to hell. By rejecting God's Love, they are condemning themselves to this place called hell, which was created for Satan and Satan's angels, not for us.

Now let us consider what you have said:

I rather be with them in hell, than watch my friends suffer.


Rather than watch your friends suffer, tell them about Jesus, and what he can do for them, and if they believe in Jesus as you do, they will not suffer.

Something you might not understand about hell: To study what the Bible says about Hell, is to understand that basically there are many cubicals in Hell, each separated from all the other cubicals. Each person condemned to Hell will spend eternity in one of those cubicals completely by themselves, completely separated from everyone else and from the Love of God, which is the Lord Jesus Christ, and being tormented by an everlasting fire.

Your old friend,

Cleveland

Love you brother,
and still praying for you.
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Postby dynastywarrior4 on Mon Oct 09, 2006 6:51 am

its hard to spread the word of JEsus and love of him. I'm in a very diverse city. My best friend is muslim, I've tryed to tell them, but they are kinda just dedicated and don't know otherwise. My parents beilieve in christ, but they also worship saints like mary and such which i know you guys aren't rooting for. My brother is straight science. I showed him this site, and he pretty much shuts down everything posted here, except the morals which jesus taught.

Where in the bible does it discuss hell crmann?

I hope everythings going good with your family man. :angel:
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Postby 4givenmuch on Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:03 am

dynastywarrior4,


Just keep praying for them and loving them. There will come a time when they come to you for advice, and you just tell them, "I can tell you what the Bible says".

It is really amazing that God has all of them around you and you being a light for them. Even when you are with them and NOT talking about God, they are watching you and the power of God in you. You are the Temple of the Holy Spirit and just by showing up, somehow in the heavenlies you are being a witness. That's faith. Don't loose heart!

If you want to know where the Bible talks about "hell" go to www.blueletterbible.com and type in "hell".

If I were you, I would just pray before, after, and during your time with them that God would use that time for His glory and protect you too.

Keep them focused on Jesus, not hell. It is His love that leads us to repentence. It is all about His love and grace.


Lord, Please encourage dynastywarrior4 in his/her walk with you. Let him/her see some fruit of Yours through them that he/she may continue to be steadfast in You Word and your love. I pray for all of the folks mentioned, brother, mom and dad, and friends that you would be wooing them with your Holy Spirit to forgiveness and truth. Thank you, Abba for the love he/she has for them already . . . evidence of You working already! :a3:
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Postby crmann on Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:07 am

Blessings, Dynasty....

To address your concerns....



he pretty much shuts down everything posted here, except the morals which jesus taught.


In other words, he thinks Jesus was just a good teacher. This shows he doesn’t know the real Jesus.

I've tryed to tell them


This is all you can do. You’ve planted a seed. If it is God’s desire, he will cause it to grow and your friend will come to know Him as you do.

but they also worship saints like mary and such


Another time I would be glad to address this if you like.

Where in the bible does it discuss hell crmann?


Now you’ve given me something to do. I’ll have to put the references together so that I can share it with you.

I hope everythings going good with your family man.


Thank you, Dynasty. God is with us. My two children both have good jobs. My daughter is now 6 mos. pregnant and doing good. We are excited about this.

Hey! I am still praying for you every day.

Love you, young fellow...

The old timer
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dynasty

Postby mjkerkau on Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:12 am

Dynasty, I'm so glad to see you posting these questions!
You seem on the verge of accepting the Truth, and these issues are holding you back. I'm praising God that you have the boldness to ask instead of just blindly following the flock (wether it be to heaven or hell).

IMO, you should not be trying to lead your family/friends to Christ when you yourself have not completely given your belief to Him. Focus on your own salvation first, do not lean on other's interpretations of the Faith.
RE: your best friend is a Muslim.... all you can do is present the Truth, pray, and watch God work. You may win him for Christ, you may lose him for good, there may be an answer down the road that is not in the time frame you would like............ but the first focus has to be upon your own salvation. Until you have put your full faith in the Lord, you will not produce for the Kingdom.

If reading is your thing.... there are many good books out with stories of people who have converted to Christianity from Islam... one I've read recently is by Caner and Caner called "Unveiling Islam."

I will be praying that you may find the Way, the Truth, and the Life..... he is such an awesome God to serve, and I'm awed everyday at the wonderful things He is doing in my life and the lives of my loved ones.

God bless!!!
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Postby crmann on Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:42 am

Here you go, Dynasty....

This is just a start, but here are a number of scriptures concerning Hell:

Dynasty, Jesus talked about Hell more than he do any other topic.

SCRIPTURES ON HELL AND THE LAKE OF FIRE

Hell is a place of consciousness-ref Lk 16:23,24; a place of DARKNESS-Mt 8:12; eternal separation from your loved ones-ref Lk 13:28; not the slightest hope of release-ref Mt 25:46. There is the torment of memory in hell. You may remember every single chance you had to repent, yet you refused-ref Lk 16:27,28.
It is written, WHOSOEVER WAS NOT FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE WAS CAST INTO THE LAKE OF FIRE-Rev 20:15; HELL FIRE-Mt 18:9; Mk 9:47; DEVOURING FIRE-Isa 33:14; EVERLASTING FIRE-Mt 25:41; a FIRE THAT NEVER SHALL BE QUENCHED-Mk 9:43; THE LAKE OF FIRE AND BRIMSTONE-Rev 20:10; COALS OF FIRE-Pv 25:22; UNQUENCHABLE FIRE-Mt 3:12; FURNACE OF FIRE-Mt 13:42; VENGEANCE OF ETERNAL FIRE-Jude 7; RAGING FIRE THAT WILL CONSUME THE ENEMIES OF GOD-Heb 10:27 NIV; TORMENTED WITH FIRE AND BRIMSTONE-Rev 14:10; ETERNAL JUDGMENT-Heb 6:2; EVERLASTING BURNINGS-Isa 33:14; EVERLASTING CONTEMPT-Dan 12:2; EVERLASTING PUNISHMENT-Mt 25:46; EVERLASTING DESTRUCTION-2 Thes 1:9; TORMENTED DAY AND NIGHT FOR EVER AND EVER-Rev 20:10; THEY ARE BURNED-Jn 15:6; WHERE THEIR WORM DIETH NOT, AND THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED-Mk 9:46; THE SMOKE OF THEIR TORMENT ASCENDETH UP FOR EVER AND EVER: AND THEY HAVE NO REST DAY NOR NIGHT-Rev 14:11; SHAME-Dan 12:2; PAINS OF HELL-Ps 116:3; OUTER DARKNESS-Mt 8:12; WEEPING AND GNASHING OF TEETH-Mt 8:12; WAILING AND GNASHING OF TEETH-Mt 13:42; HE LIFT UP HIS EYES, BEING IN TORMENTS-Lk 16:23; AND HE CRIED...I AM TORMENTED IN THIS FLAME-Lk 16:24; HAVE MERCY ON ME-Lk 16:24.
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Postby JR on Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:58 am

Dynasty,

You are being surrounded by a lot of good advice here. Here are a few thoughts.

We have all been on airplanes and heard this. "In case of loss of cabin pressure, masks will drop down, put on your own mask first and then help your little ones."

Dynasty, allow Christ to come into your heart first, before you try / think to help anyone else. Your changed life, will speak more to them then any clever argument could. They know who you are today and will see a change, if you let Christ in as your Savior.

Coming to Christ requires you admitting you are a sinner (sometimes this is easy) and admitting you need a Savior (often times this is difficult). You have a choice.

You can not come to Christ on your own terms. That is saying you do not need a Savior, because you can make your own way / terms. Christ's terms are the only terms. He is the Savior and we are not.

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Postby crmann on Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:22 am

 
Here is a short study of hell by Pastor David L. Brown, Ph.D.

He says we don’t hear many sermons about hell any more. However in this nation’s history,"Hell, Fire & Brimstone"sermons played a key role in The Great Awakening. The sermon he is referring to is Jonathan Edwards, Sinners In The Hand of An Angry God. The message was preached in Enfield, Connecticut July 8, 1741. This powerful message can be read at:

http://logosresourcepages.org/GreatSermons/angry.htm

For the most part, "Hell, Fire & Brimstone" preaching is a thing of the past, even within fundamental circles. The politically correct messages of this era steer around anything controversial. They do not address the issues of sin or God’s judgment on sin, but rather focus on love, unity, and grace. While these are perfectly good topics to preach on, if they are framed biblically, preachers need to follow the pattern of the Apostle Paul who wrote… "For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God." Acts 20:27

Hell is a very real place. And while it was not initially created by God for people but the sinning angels, it will be the abode of all nonbelievers for all of eternity.

Let's look at Matthew 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels"

2 Peter 2:4-9 "For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly; 7 And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked: 8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;) 9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished"

Psalms 9:17 makes it very clear that, "The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God."

We cannot dare to ignore these teachings on hell!

Hell In the Old Testament:

The word hell occurs thirty one times in the Old Testament. The first time the word hell is used in our King Jame Bible is Deuteronomy 32:22 "For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains."

The Hebrew word commonly translated "hell" is sheol. In the Old Testament, the word Hell (sheol) has two meanings. Sometimes it means the place where the bodies of the dead are laid (Psalm 6:5; Ecclesiastes 9:10; Isaiah 38:18,19). But it normally refers to the place where the soul and spirit went upon the death of a person. (Genesis 37:35; Psalm 9:17; 16:10; 30:3; 55:15; Proverbs 15:24; 23:14).

Hell In the New Testament

The word hell occurs twenty three times in the New Testament. The first time the word is used in the New Testament is in Matthew 5:22 "But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."

What Is Hell Like?

Hell is…
A place of punishment – Matthew 25:46 "And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." ? 
A place of banishment – 2 Thessalonians 1:9 "Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;"? 
A place of fire & worms – Mark 9:42-48 "And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. 43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. 45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: 46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. 47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire: 48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."? 
A place of darkness – Jude 1:13 "Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever."? 
A place of torment – Revelation 20:10 "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."? 
A place of consciousness and feeling – Luke 16:23 "And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom."? 
A place of thirst – Luke 16:24 "And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame."? 
A place without hope of escape – Luke 16:26 "And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."? 
A place of unfulfilled desires and unanswered prayers – Luke 16:27-31 "Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: 28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. 29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. 30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. 31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."? 
A place of weeping and gnashing of teeth – Matthew 25:30 "And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." This gnashing of teeth, is not because of torment, but these people in hell will be gnashing their teeth in anger an hate, cursing the name of Jesus.

Hell’s no joke! Hell is a very real, and very horrible place! Those who have not believed the Gospel and received Christ as your Savior, will find themselves in this place for all of eternity. Paul wrote that Christ is coming "In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;" 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

But remember, Hell was prepared for Satan and his angels. The vengeance talked about is a vengeance that was to be directed towards Satan and his angels. Multitudes of people have chosen to reject God through Jesus and in fact have condemned themselves to this place called Hell. It is not God's desire that any should perish, but to have everlasting life. God sends no one to Hell.


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Re: BREAKING NEWS - AYATOLLAH REVOLTS IN IRAN

Postby Tevye on Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:29 am

BondservanttoJesus wrote:BREAKING NEWS - AYATOLLAH REVOLTS IN IRAN


The current Islamic regime's reaction was to issue death warrant for him falsely claiming apostasy by him because he was said by them to have claimed to be the 12th Imam, who disappeared down a well 1300 years ago and will return to redeem the world.




Link to article


Went down a well and will be returning as the messiah/redeemer of the Islamic world.

Sounds like a verse I know.

Revelation 13
11Then I saw another beast, coming out of the earth. He had two horns like a lamb, but he spoke like a dragon. 12He exercised all the authority of the first beast on his behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast..

Also.

Revelation 17
8The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and will come up out of the Abyss...

abyss
noun [C usually singular]
1 LITERARY a very deep hole which seems to have no bottom.

Interesting.
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Postby bok on Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:51 am

dynastywarrior4 wrote:Why is God giving me these options?

Kinda like the Iraq Government back when SAddam was in power. Follow him or die/or sent to his underground prisons.

Follow Christ or go to hell. Follow Saddam or die.

I'm trying to find christ man, but I wont accept the damnation of my loved ones. I rather be with them in hell, then watch them suffer. I know this might sound messed up but, meh.

Day by day i look for christ. A couple hours ago, i felt something, then it faded. :cry:


dynastywarrior4,

Jesus knew that you would be facing a challenge with your friends and family. He knew that he would be a polarizing figure and that even entire households would be divided over him. He said this,

Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three. They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law."

Luke 12:51-53


He doesn't want you to go with your entire family to hell. He wants you saved! And if you're saved, you have a much better chance of showing your family and friends what a changed life looks like and attracting them to begin asking the same questions that you're asking now.

One thing I want to encourage you on... read your Bible, starting with the Book of John. Just do that one thing, praying for God's wisdom, and let us know what God has revealed to you.

Jesus wants you to come home desperately! He says,

Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me. To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says..."

Revelation 3:20-22


Prayers up for the Holy Spirit to guide you in your walk.

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Postby member x on Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:28 am

dynastywarrior4 wrote:long post yet insightful.

and if it is true than this means that every man that does not except Christ as Lord and King will be thrown into Hell.


Why is God giving me these options?

Kinda like the Iraq Government back when SAddam was in power. Follow him or die/or sent to his underground prisons.

Follow Christ or go to hell. Follow Saddam or die.

I'm trying to find christ man, but I wont accept the damnation of my loved ones. I rather be with them in hell, then watch them suffer. I know this might sound messed up but, meh.

Day by day i look for christ. A couple hours ago, i felt something, then it faded. :cry:
[/quote]

hello dynastywarrior4,

first, i'd like to say i am so glad you are here on this board. God is drawing you and speaking to your heart. you ask many good questions, as one should.

the questions you asked here are very tough but yet there is an asnwer. I see you posted on the thread i titled "why does a loving God send people to hell?" - though i am not sure if you were just commenting on someon's post, or if you read through it.

http://fulfilledprophecy.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=15205

please let me know your thoughts. i will be praying for you

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Postby Triton57 on Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:16 pm

dynastywarrior4 wrote:My brother is straight science. I showed him this site, and he pretty much shuts down everything posted here, except the morals which jesus taught.

For your brother, I would recommend Dr. Kent Hovind's DVD series on creation vs. evolution. Whether or not your brother believes in evolution, Dr. Hovind presents the scientific facts that support God's creation of the universe. You can view them free online here.
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Postby Spreading Salt on Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:04 pm

Also, check out The Case for Faith by Lee Strobel. He covers evolution, a loving God and the existence of hell, miracles contradicting science, and much much more.

Have a good read!
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Postby Finaldash on Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:21 pm

dynastywarrior4 wrote:well skipper, there brought up not to speak up agaisnt their beiliefs. Again i say, my beilief Jesus will save every good hearted person. He died for everyones sins regardless of who they are, and I truthly beilieve Jesus is the kind of being who will do the richeous thing.

mainly i beilieve cause i want everyone with a good heart to be saved. I know thats so much to ask but ya kno.


Dynasty,
Please read all of Romans chapter 3. Here are some scriptures that you can check out. Romans 3:10 says: As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one.
Then it tells us in Romans 3:23: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. It basically means that no one is deserving of Heaven because all have sinned. Not a single sin is allowed in Heaven. Heaven is a perfect place. So what is the result of sin? Opposite of Heaven, Hell. Romans 6:23 tell us For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
God understood that we cannot achieve perfection on our own. He is so merciful that He sent his one and only son to Earth and experience what we experience and endure humiliation and suffering just like every one of us. Although he probably suffered more than all of us. Can you imagine doing that to the maker of the universe? Such humility?
Jesus was the only candidate possible as a perfect sacrifice for all our sins because he was perfect because He is God. He also endured everything we have experienced and understands us because he was also human.
So what does God want you and your family to do to get to heaven? Two of my fav. verses, John 1:10 says: Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God And of course John 3:16 says: “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
How easy does that sound? Only if you believe it.

David
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Postby Earalav on Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:06 pm

Finaldash wrote:
dynastywarrior4 wrote:well skipper, there brought up not to speak up agaisnt their beiliefs. Again i say, my beilief Jesus will save every good hearted person. He died for everyones sins regardless of who they are, and I truthly beilieve Jesus is the kind of being who will do the richeous thing.

mainly i beilieve cause i want everyone with a good heart to be saved. I know thats so much to ask but ya kno.


Dynasty,
Please read all of Romans chapter 3. Here are some scriptures that you can check out. Romans 3:10 says: As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one.
Then it tells us in Romans 3:23: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. It basically means that no one is deserving of Heaven because all have sinned. Not a single sin is allowed in Heaven. Heaven is a perfect place. So what is the result of sin? Opposite of Heaven, Hell. Romans 6:23 tell us For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
God understood that we cannot achieve perfection on our own. He is so merciful that He sent his one and only son to Earth and experience what we experience and endure humiliation and suffering just like every one of us. Although he probably suffered more than all of us. Can you imagine doing that to the maker of the universe? Such humility?
Jesus was the only candidate possible as a perfect sacrifice for all our sins because he was perfect because He is God. He also endured everything we have experienced and understands us because he was also human.
So what does God want you and your family to do to get to heaven? Two of my fav. verses, John 1:10 says: Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God And of course John 3:16 says: “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
How easy does that sound? Only if you believe it.

David


and what does it mean to believe?

Some get very confused about what it means to "believe" in Jesus/God. The Bible says that even the demons in hell believe in God, but we know that they are not saved.

Believing in God is not simply thinking that God exists and that there is probably truth to all this Bible stuff. Believing in God is a complete life altering choice.

Imagine that you are going to buy your first computer. You have one big choice to make before you can even really start deciding on the size of the hard drive or what kind of screen: will I buy a Mac or a PC? We can choose the PC like the majority of people or the Mac which far fewer people choose. Those who choose the PC, do so because it is the easy choice: everyone has one, all the programs run on it, the world just seems to be wired for it. The Mac on the other hand is the harder choice: we will be limited in what programs we can use, we are familiar with the PC, the Mac will be strange and different. The fact is those who have never used a Mac tend to be afraid of it. Yet we have heard how wonderful the Mac is: it doesn't get viruses, it is easier to use, it is far more capable than a PC, the system is just better: at least that is what everyone who owns a Mac says.

So why don't more people buy the Mac? They just don't believe it. If they really believed it they would take the leap of faith and buy the Mac. After all buying a computer is an expensive option. Once you buy it, you are stuck with it for a long time. What if it doesn't work out? So, you have to make a choice.

Believing in Jesus is taking that leap of faith. It is deciding that what the Bible says about God, every word of it, is absolutely true. It is deciding that I am going to just go for it. I am going to become a "Mac" person. I eschew the "PC" life. I choose God and not the world. I am going to live my life according to the OS system and not DOS.

So, dynastywarrior4, what are you going to be, a PC or a Mac? Are you going to accept Jesus as the one and only Savior of the world and live for Him eternally or are you going to stick with the system run by the devil and end up in the place prepared for him?

Because He loves you,
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Postby Finaldash on Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:46 am

Earalav,
I like your techie style of preaching :grin:
When I say believe I mean first commandment type of believe. Which is to love God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.
A belief that will result in good works (fruits of the spirit) and not because of it.
I thought somebody might catch me on that.
You see someone that came from the catholic church like me and Dynasty works is not something which I wanted to emphasize to a new seeker. Grace like Eph. 2:8 is what I wanted to present.
So Dynasty how does one know if they are truly a christian? By their fruits. Faith without works is dead.
But you only need to have a genuine belief to be saved. No strings attached.
Just remember what the other criminal said to Jesus on the cross next to Him. All he did was acknowledge that Jesus was who he said he is, and immediately Jesus declared that he was going to heaven with Him.

David
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Postby brandon on Tue Oct 10, 2006 2:56 am

Earalav wrote:"Mac" Message.


Along with this potent message of "Good Apple News," there's also "Living a One-Click Life," "Apostasy of Mac-Intels," and "Wrath of the Mac upon a PC using World."
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Postby 4givenmuch on Tue Oct 10, 2006 6:25 am

dynasty,


So Dynasty how does one know if they are truly a christian? By their fruits. Faith without works is dead. (From previous post)



Galatians 5:22-23 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.


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Postby crmann on Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:28 am

Hey, Dynasty....

We Love you.


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