King David will reign in Jerusalem

[Tevye]

After carefully studying the Old Testament prophets Jeremiah, Hosea and Ezekiel, one cannot come to any
other conclusion than this: King David will reign in Jerusalem under Jesus, the Messiah during the millennium.
-
A careful examination of Jeremiah, Hosea and Ezekiel clearly leads us to the conclusion that,
during the millennium, Jesus will be present as the Messiah, while David will be present
fulfilling the role of the "prince." ...., he will be resurrected to fulfill this role.
bibletrack.org/notes

[drdos]

That's not what the Revelation of Yeshua talks about IMO. Christ will Rule along with Resurected Saints
(Rev 2:26) And he who overcomes and keeps My works to the end, to him I will give power over the nations.

(Rev 2:27) And he will rule them with a rod of iron, as the vessels of a potter they will be broken to pieces, even as I received from My Father.

(Rev 2:28) And I will give him the Morning Star.

(Isa 2:1) The Word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.

(Isa 2:2) And it shall be, in the last days the mountain of Jehovah's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow into it.

(Isa 2:3) And many people shall go and say, Come, and let us go to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob. And He will teach us of His ways, and we will walk in His paths. For out of Zion shall go out the Law, and the Word of Jehovah from Jerusalem.

(Isa 2:4) And He shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning-hooks. Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

[Tevye]

Christ will Rule along with Resurected Saints

You're right, He will....

David, the king
-
“In that day,”
declares the Lord Almighty, “I will break the yoke off their necks
and will tear off their bonds; no longer will foreigners enslave them.
Instead, they will serve the Lord their God
and David their king,
whom I will raise up for them” (Jer. 30:8,9).

This is a prophecy that Israel will serve two people: 1) Jesus, their Lord and God and
2) David their king, who will be resurrected.

Some interpret “David” as being another name for Jesus. I disagree and believe that King David,
from ancient times, literally will be the king over Israel (under Jesus, the King of kings) after
the 70th Week is over. In the New Testament, Jesus is called “the son of David” (Matt. 1:1),
David’s “Lord” (22:45), a “descendant of David” (Rom. 1:3), “the Root of David” (Rev. 5:5b),
and “the Root and the Offspring of David” (22:16b); but I can find no place where Jesus
is referred to specifically by the term, “David.”

God, through Jeremiah, also said,

Their leader will be one of their own; their ruler will arise from among them.
I will bring him near and he will come close to me, for who is he who will
devote himself to be close to me? (Jer. 30:21).

The “leader” who is “close” to God is David,
whom God already has once chosen to lead His people:

...the Lord has sought out a man [David] after his own heart
and appointed him leader of his people... (1 Sam. 13:14b).

God told Hosea that, after “...many days [centuries] without king or prince,...
the Israelites will return and seek the Lord their God and David their king”
(Hosea 3:4,5a). Furthermore, God also said, pertaining to the time after Jesus’ return,

I will save my flock, and they will no longer be plundered. I will judge between one sheep and another.
I will place over them one shepherd, my servant David, and he will tend them; he will tend them and be their
shepherd. I the Lord will be their God, and my servant David will be prince among them (Ezek. 34:22-24b).
link

[1whowaits]

It is clear from scripture that it is Jesus who rules- 'He will rule them with an iron scepter..' Rev 19, and 'the survivors from all the nations...will go up...to worship the King, the Lord Almighty...' Zech 14.

The throne is promised to the Messiah- 'He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom..'Isa 9, and it is Jesus who will reign on the throne of David- 'The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever..' Luke 1.

Jesus reigning over the house of Jacob (Israel) forever on David's own throne would appear to rule out David reigning on that throne. Jesus is called the son of David, He reigns on the throne of His father David, Jesus is David's heir, and as God promised David someone from his house would rule on David's throne forever 'when your days are over....I will raise up your offspring to succeed you...I will set him over my house and my kingdom forever; his throne will be established forever' 1 Chron 17.

So it would appear that the references to David ruling on the throne during the millenium are references to Jesus as the son of David, David's heir, the promised son of David being pictured as David himself reigning on the throne of David.

[Tevye]

We know from scripture that Yeshua will rule the whole Earth on that day.

"And in that day it shall be
that living waters shall flow from Jerusalem, half of them toward the eastern sea
and half of them toward the western sea; in both summer and winter it shall occur.
And the LORD shall be King over all the earth. In that day it shall be
“ The LORD is one,” and His name one." - Zechariah 14

It is also written, according to Ezekiel 37, that David will rule as king over Israel.
I believe that there will be many kings who will rule in many places around the Earth.
These kings will be appointed by Yeshua to rule with Him during His 1000 year kingdom.
We're given beforehand, who the king in Israel at that time will be, it's David.

"For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince,
without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim.
Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek
the LORD their God and David their king.
They shall fear the LORD and His goodness in the latter days."

According to Hosea chapter 3
long after Israel has not had a king
they will return to their land
and seek the Lord (Yeshua)
and they will have David as their king.

Also:
In Ezekiel

Chapter 36 and 37 describe how God will bring His people Israel back to their land
to dwell in peace and that He would set His servant David as king over them forever.
Link

‘Thus says the Lord GOD:
“Surely I will take the children of Israel from among the nations, wherever they have gone,
and will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land; and I will make them
one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king over them all;
they shall no longer be two nations, nor shall they ever be divided into two kingdoms again.
They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols, nor with their detestable things,
nor with any of their transgressions; but I will deliver them from all their dwelling places
in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them.
Then they shall be My people, and I will be their God.
David My servant shall be king over them, and they shall all have one shepherd;
they shall also walk in My judgments and observe My statutes, and do them.
Then they shall dwell in the land that I have given to Jacob My servant,
where your fathers dwelt; and they shall dwell there, they, their children,
and their children’s children, forever; and My servant David shall be their prince forever."
Ezekiel chapter 37

Yeshua is King of kings and David is His servant.
(alongside all who are God's servants, who will reign together with him)

When the Lord appears in glory
He will make every mountain low, and raise every valley up.
This appears to be a reference that the Lord will be the most high King
and every other authority will be leveled below Him, yet given authority to reign with Him.

Isaiah chapter 40- ((scripturelink))

"It is He who sits above the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers, who stretches out the heavens like a curtain,
and spreads them out like a tent to dwell in. He brings the princes to nothing...
-
The everlasting God, the LORD, The Creator of the ends of the earth, neither faints nor is weary.
His understanding is unsearchable. He gives power to the weak, and to those who have no might
He increases strength. Even the youths shall faint and be weary, and the young men shall utterly fall,
but those who wait on the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings like eagles,
they shall run and not be weary, they shall walk and not faint."

[1whowaits]

The references to David ruling Israel forever when other scriptures describe Jesus ruling Israel forever can be confusing. Perhaps asking some logical question might help clarify things a bit.

So Jesus will reign on David's throne forever, and if David reigns at the same time, David reigns on.....not David's throne? As Jesus is king and reigns on the throne of David, from what position does David rule? David is clearly not king and he is not on his own throne.

Jesus reigns on David's throne forever-' God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever.' Luke 1, and Ezek 37 states- 'David my servant will be their prince forever.' So which person really rules Israel forever?

"My servant David will be king over them, and they will all have one shepherd.' Ezk 37. Zech 14 indicates that Jesus is the King who rules from Jerusalem, so if David is also king then Israel will have 2 shepherds, not 1 as Ezek states. Ezek 37 would appear to rule out 2 rulers of Israel.

If both Jesus and David rule Israel forever, then Israel does not have 1 shepherd and the scripture is in error, which of course it is not. If Israel has 1 shepherd and David rules forever then Jesus does not, which of course is not correct. If Jesus rules Israel forever, then the references to David ruling forever would most likely be pointing to Jesus, as David's son, reigning on David's throne, fulfilling David's rule, which is the most logical conclusion, imo.

[drdos]

If both Jesus and David rule Israel forever, then Israel does not have 1 shepherd and the scripture is in error, which of course it is not. If Israel has 1 shepherd and David rules forever then Jesus does not, which of course is not correct. If Jesus rules Israel forever, then the references to David ruling forever would most likely be pointing to Jesus, as David's son, reigning on David's throne, fulfilling David's rule, which is the most logical conclusion, imo.

I agree here.

[Tevye]

There is no confusion...

God is God,
and we are His servants
that includes King David.
God is not a servant to Himself.
Scripture tells us that it will be His servant David who will rule Israel.
King David will not rule the world or any other people on Earth.
Scripture is straightforward and very clear, king David is king David.

"Then they shall be My people, and I will be their God."

Even when David is raised up to be their prince forever
(given that he will also have eternal life in Christ)
they shall still be the people of God.

"David My servant shall be king over them, and they shall all have one shepherd;"

King David will be king and he will be the one shepherd over all of Israel.
Whereas before there were two kings, two shepherds,
at that time there will be only one.

Yes, Yeshua will be the King over all the Earth,
and He will establish the thrones of His earthly kings
Yeshua is the Son of God, not a servant to Himself.
There is no confusion.....only clarity, truth and light in Yeshua.

[good4u1]

Wait a minute, wait a minute...all this ruling or not ruling is confusing....from the way I understand it...and we ALL could be wrong as the Kingdom of Heaven has not been made a physical reality yet...

1) Jesus is King. Ruler of All. Ruler of ALL the Nations. Jesus rules from earthly Jerusalem.
I think we all can agree on this.

2) David will oversee (under Jesus's direction) the House of Israel. David will again manage the Jews politically, but only the Jews.

3) The other gentile nations...where do they fit? They will be managed by the Church Saints and distributed responsibility according the their faithfulness to Jesus during their earthly lives.

We don't know the exact complete outcome of the Kingdom of Heaven and all its ramifications since we are not there yet. So all of details and structure is purely speculation until the King returns. So all opinions are as good as others.

Blessings.

[Tevye]

Scripture is clear, there is no confusion.

Scripture is not on opinion, it is the truth of God in Christ.
If scripture tells us that King David is a servant and will be rasied up
people can choose to believe what God tells us or they can
choose to believe the myth and deviate from His truth.
Myths lead people away from the straight path to truth
myths build hedges in front of us and prevent us
from seeing the whole picture the Lord has given us.
God is not the author of confusion, He is the author of life.
He gave us His word and His truth, His story to know it now.
If He intended for us to wait and see how it will all pan out
then I imagine He would not have given us His prophecy.

[Tevye]

1) Jesus is King. Ruler of All. Ruler of ALL the Nations. Jesus rules from earthly Jerusalem.
I think we all can agree on this.

2) David will oversee (under Jesus's direction) the House of Israel. David will again manage the Jews politically, but only the Jews.

3) The other gentile nations...where do they fit? They will be managed by the Church Saints and distributed responsibility according the their faithfulness to Jesus during their earthly lives.

I wanted to add that I fully agree with your assessment on all three points there.
I would only add the O/T saints to point three, the faithful Israel
as we are grafted into the olive tree, and are forever a part of them.
See, you are not confused, the Spirit of the Lord revealed this to you.
Yeshua will rule the Whole Earth from His city the New Jerusalem
and what a grand city it will be. The largest one of all time.
I imagine in this great city where Christ's throne will be the center
that there will be other adminstrative posts, king's seats
that will be in Jerusalem for them to shepherd the nations from.
On that point, one can only imagine, except for King David
we know from scripture his throne for Israel will also
be in the city of David, Jerusalem.

cityofdavid.org

[drdos]

All in All (deleted bad comment sorry Tevye) It's Jesus who is and will be My King. I don't know why this thread matters that much. I am just waiting for Jesus not David.

[Tevye]

I do understand your feelings drdos.
Why does God give us messages that are difficult
or that challenge ideas that have been so rooted
in theological circles? So we will get frustrated? Or could it be
that He gives spiritual insights so we will grow closer to Him?
The are some messages in the Bible that seem insignificant
to where we are now, living in this broken world. I believe
that God gives us information that the world refuses to accept
He gives us pieces to the prophecy puzzle at different times in life
and as we journey along the trail closer to His kingdom
we start to see the pieces come together
and the picture of His intentions become clear.
Sometimes it's like, why God? Why show me this now?
I believe He want's us to see, to believe His whole story
from creation all the way through into His kingdom.
Someday it will all make sense, not that we are confused
just that we need to shed off the old skin and take on the new.
I imagine on that day, when He appears and we are changed
that there will be a great sound by us here on Earth
just before being caught up to meet Him.

Ahhhh, so that's... ohhh wow!

I hope I have not upset you sir,
I know sometimes my responses can appear direct.
I think sometimes I try too hard to convince others
or make others happy. In my life I've been told
how difficult a person I can be to understand
or that I will never amount to anything
so in my older age, I have become bolder
and more assertive in some of my ways.
I try to be balanced and concerned about others feelings
so I strive not to be offensive and be more encouraging
yet there are those moments, when one needs to clarify.

[drdos]

I do understand your feelings drdos.
Why does God give us messages that are difficult
or that challenge ideas that have been so rooted
in theological circles? So we will get frustrated? Or could it be
that He gives spiritual insights so we will grow closer to Him?
The are some messages in the Bible that seem insignificant
to where we are now, living in this broken world. I believe
that God gives us information that the world refuses to accept
He gives us pieces to the prophecy puzzle at different times in life
and as we journey along the trail closer to His kingdom
we start to see the pieces come together
and the picture of His intentions become clear.
Sometimes it's like, why God? Why show me this now?
I believe He want's us to see, to believe His whole story
from creation all the way through into His kingdom.
Someday it will all make sense, not that we are confused
just that we need to shed off the old skin and take on the new.
I imagine on that day, when He appears and we are changed
that there will be a great sound by us here on Earth
just before being caught up to meet Him.

Ahhhh, so that's... ohhh wow!

I hope I have not upset you sir,
I know sometimes my responses can appear direct.
I think sometimes I try too hard to convince others
or make others happy. In my life I've been told
how difficult a person I can be to understand
or that I will never amount to anything
so in my older age, I have become bolder
and more assertive in some of my ways.
I try to be balanced and concerned about others feelings
so I strive not to be offensive and be more encouraging
yet there are those moments, when one needs to clarify.

No No Brother you have not upset me, and you're right about wanting to know the whole story. Though we won't know all till we see Jesus, but he wants us to strive to know. I'm just confused by even thinking that David be a ruler again. Yes he was a man after God's own heart but he's not Jesus. Oh and Brother you happen to be one of the most encouraging people on this Forum!

[good4u1]

Excuse, Tevye...Scripture is clear BUT your interpretation of Scripture may NOT always be correct and neither is mine. That is what I should have said and that is TRUTH. I am sorry I was not clear in my communication of my point initially. Do you see how human communication is flawed? Example 1.

I am not confused about what I know, but I was confused regarding the exchanges in this thread...but knowing whose here that doesn't surprise me.

[good4u1]

All in All I don't really care about what David will be doing or not It's Jesus who is and will be My King. I don't know why this thread matters that much. I am just waiting for Jesus not David.

But you should care, dodos. Israel will be deeply involved in the administration of the Kingdom Age and why the Lord's Apostles were so interested in when He was going to restore their nation to them. The redeemed Jews along with the Saints will have much influence within the Kingdom. But King Jesus will be in the center of it all!

[drdos]

All in All I don't really care about what David will be doing or not It's Jesus who is and will be My King. I don't know why this thread matters that much. I am just waiting for Jesus not David.

But you should care, dodos. Israel will be deeply involved in the administration of the Kingdom Age and why the Lord's Apostles were so interested in when He was going to restore their nation to them. The redeemed Jews along with the Saints will have much influence within the Kingdom. But King Jesus will be in the center of it all!

I think you missed my point. It is not about David were not waiting for him.

[good4u1]

Then exactly what is your point? Make your point clearly, please.

I don't have time...be back another time.

[drdos]

Then exactly what is your point? Make your point clearly, please.

I was trying to. The millennial Kingdom is about Jesus not David.

[1whowaits]

Tevye, there does appear to be some confusion, it does appear that often in the OT the term 'my servant' is a reference to the Messiah, Jesus- 'by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many, and he will bear their inquities..' Is 53, clearly a reference to Jesus. 'Here is my servant....my chosen one in whom I delight...I...will make you to be a covenant for the people and a light to the gentiles..' Isa 42, again an obvious reference to Jesus the Messiah.

When the Father refers to the Messiah, His Son, in the OT, He often uses the term 'my servant'. The reference to 'my servant David' in Ezek 37 can certainly be a reference to the Messiah, the son of David, who rules on David's throne. Ezek 37 also states - 'David my servant will be their prince forever. I will make a covenant of peace with them; it will be an everlasting covenant.' The 'everlasting covenant' mentioned after describing David being prince forever is the covenant of Jesus Christ, described elsewhere as the everlasting covenant.

And what was God's promise to David, that David would reign over Israel forever, or one of David's decendants would reign forever? 'When your days are over and you go to be with your fathers, I will raise up your offsping to succeed you, one of you own sons, and I will establish his kingdom..and I will establish his throne forever.... I will set him over my house and my kingdom forever; his throne will be established forever.' 1 Chron 17.

God's promise to David was not that David would reign forever, but that David's descendant, the Messiah, Jesus, David's son, would reign forever.

Jesus does state that those who overcome will reign with Him over the world, and that would include David, as well as Moses, Abraham, and all christians. As far as who has a role in ruling over Israel, Jesus indicated a particular group has this role, the disciples- 'I confer on you a kingdom....so that you may sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.' Luke 23.

So David, and all the OT saints, and all who believe will reign with Christ, but in the end it is Christ who is the King, the Prince, the ultimate ruler of all.

So when Ezek 37 refers to 'my servant David' being king over Israel, the 1 shepherd, is the passage indicating the rule of David, and the disciples and the OT saints and all believers under the rule of Jesus? Or is it more likely referring to the fulfillment of God's promise to David, that David's decendant would rule over Israel forever (1 Chron 17), and to the promise that the Messiah would rule forever on David's throne (Isa 9)?

[drdos]

So David, and all the OT saints, and all who believe will reign with Christ, but in the end it is Christ who is the King, the Prince, the ultimate ruler of all.

That's how I read it, and yes it can get a little confusing.

[good4u1]

This whole thread is much a do about nothing. Geesh!

[Tevye]

Tevye, there does appear to be some confusion,

Hello 1whowaits,
still no confusion, only a choice... to believe.

Yes it is correct that Isaiah 53 describes Yeshua as a Servant to the Father.
Yet, Isaiah 53 and Ezekiel 37 are two seperate messages...

In the context of Ezekiel 37:24-25 there is another reference to "Jacob My servant"
this gives us the indication that the reference to "David my servant" is actually the person David.

Something I noticed is that the word Servant in Isaiah 53 is capitalized
while the word servant in Ezekiel is not, giving us the indication
that the servant of Ezekiel is a servant of God, while the Servant in Isaiah 53 is God.
This is not an opinion, or mere interpretation, it is how God inspiried by His Spirit
the translators to write the passages so we would see what God intended for us to see.

The 'everlasting covenant' mentioned after describing David being prince forever is the covenant of Jesus Christ, described elsewhere as the everlasting covenant.

A covenant with a design and choice for His servant to be the (lessser to Christ) prince
who will oversee this covenant for his people as a type of representative for them to identify with.

And what was God's promise to David, that David would reign over Israel forever, or one of David's decendants would reign forever?

The message of Ezekiel 37 and the servant David came after David lived
therefore the intent of the message was not for David's benefit
but for the people who are the focus, in the context of the message.

“Surely I will take the children of Israel from among the nations, wherever they have gone,
and will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land; and I will make them
one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king over them all;
(Israel will have only one king verses having a divided kingdom with two kings)

One thing we have lost as a people of the modern age is the identity found in a monarch.
When I traveled to England and spoke with family there and their friends about the queen
they expressed that we do not have a monarch and could not comprehend the connection.
It's about so many things we have lost in our time, such as identity, history, honor and so on.
Ultimately we are called as Christians, as followers of Christ, to find our identity in Yeshua.
God has a purpose, and identity and direction for the people of Israel within His coming kingdom.
Even now the people of Israel ultimately find their identity as a nation in their prince, king David.
King David is not the way of salvation for their souls, he is the person they 'connect' to as a people.
Kind David is who they are, he is the one given to them as a national identity, as a 'prince' for them.

God's promise to David was not that David would reign forever, but that David's descendant, the Messiah, Jesus, David's son, would reign forever.

The type of authority that is designated in scripture to Yeshua
is completely different to the position that king David will hold.
Yeshua is God and therefore His dominion, His kingdom is of heaven.
It will begin and be here upon the whole Earth, when He appears in glory.
Even though David struggled in his life, God has chosen him to be their 'prince' forever.
(Just thought....that maybe there is a great message of God's grace to be found in this?)
Now, how the adminstrative works of God's coming kingdom on Earth will be delagated
is yet to be known and seen, but according to scripture it appears as though the Lord
has intended for Israel to continue forever to be set apart from the nations
as a holy people for His purpose, and according to Ezekiel 37 Israel's
internal identity as a people will be in David, God's servant and prince.
I imagine that the other nations, the other ethnic peoples on earth
will also have a particular way of identifying who they are.
Many of us who are not given such a blessing of ethnic identity
cannot understand the feeling that can be difficult to describe
by knowing who we are or where are from.
For those of us who do not know...
we can find our identity in Messiah Yeshua.

"What if God, wanting to show His wrath and to make His power known,
endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath prepared for destruction,
and that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy,
which He had prepared beforehand for glory, even us whom He called,
not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
As He says also in Hosea:
“ I will call them My people, who were not My people, and her beloved, who was not beloved.”
“ And it shall come to pass in the place where it was said to them, ‘ You are not My people,’
There they shall be called sons of the living God.” Romans chapter 9

One day, we who have no concrete idea of our identity
will be found in Him. For now we are hidden in Christ
given a deposit that He will redeem on the day of His appearing.

So when Ezek 37 refers to 'my servant David' being king over Israel, the 1 shepherd, is the passage indicating the rule of David, and the disciples and the OT saints and all believers under the rule of Jesus? Or is it more likely referring to the fulfillment of God's promise to David, that David's decendant would rule over Israel forever (1 Chron 17), and to the promise that the Messiah would rule forever on David's throne (Isa 9)?

I believe Ezekiel 37 is only about David, God's servant and Israel's future united kingdom.

(The promise, the prophecy of Ezekiel chapter 37 is for Israel
and not intended to glorify David above Yehsua or Israel
he is the Lord's servant and will be Israel's servant, her prince forever.)

"Again the word of the LORD came to me, saying,
“As for you, son of man, take a stick for yourself and write on it: ‘For Judah and for the children of Israel,
his companions.’ Then take another stick and write on it, ‘For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house
of Israel, his companions.’ Then join them one to another for yourself into one stick,
and they will become one in your hand. “And when the children of your people speak to you, saying,
‘Will you not show us what you mean by these?’ say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Surely I will
take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel, his companions;
and I will join them with it, with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they will be one in My hand.”"

Yeshua's kingdom and throne is so much higher than any earthly throne.
It will be in the midst of the New Jerusalem as the most high of all thrones.
While Israel will be special, or holy during Yeshua's kingdom of the earth
there will be other earthly kingdoms under Yeshua, He will be the King of the kings on earth.
I don't believe David's throne will be so much about David as it will be about God's choice
for Israel to be given an identity in His servant David. As a gift to the remnant destined to endure.

"The nations also will know that I, the LORD, sanctify Israel, when My sanctuary is in their midst forevermore."
Israel will be set apart, they will have Yeshua as their Messiah, and He will have David as their prince, forever.

[Jay Ross]

Perhaps Jesus' words in this short parable may be the missing clue.

Or what king, going to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and take counsel whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends an embassy and asks terms of peace.

The timing for when this will happen might be found in the following verse from a Psalm.

I will cause your name to be remembered for two ages/generations;
after which the peoples will revere you forever and ever.

It is just a thought.

[Mrs. B]

King David Will Reign in Jerusalem.......

Jesus came out of the loins of David.......

Jesus is came from the seed of David......David called Him My Lord.

Jesus is the Promise Seed of Abraham.....

Mrs. B

[1whowaits]

Teyve, i would disagree with your view about the reign of Jesus after He returns. Jesus is the King of an earthly kingdom(as well as heavenly) and He reigns from Jerusalem- 'the survivors of the nations...will go up year after year to worship ther KIng, the Lord Almighty, and to celebrate the feast of Tabernacles...' Zech 14.

The King is the Lord Almighty, Jesus, and He regins from Jerusalem, an earthly city. Jesus is actively ruling from Jerusalem, and those who do not go up to worship Him are punished by Him, as Zech 14 further deliniates. Jesus is not a ruler from a distance, He is the one who punishes directly, and His throne is in Jerusalem, and people worship and see Him directly.

And there is no mention of David in this passage, if David rules and is king during this time where is he? Should he not be in Jerusalem juding the peoples, as he is the king as Ezek 37 states?

Jesus is also active in teaching the nations from Jerusalem- 'Many people will come and say, Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob. He will teach us His ways so that we may walk in His paths. The law wil go out from Zion, the word of the Lord from Jerusalem. He will judge between the nations and will settle disputes for many peoples...Come, O house of Jacob, let us walk in the light of the Lord.' Isa 2.

It is Jesus who instructs, Jesus who passes judgement, who reigns from the temple, and Israel walks in His light, because He lives among the people of Israel in Jerusalem. Where is David, there is no mention of him, is he not king as Ezek 37 states? If Ezek 37 is indeed describing David and David is king as Ezek states, should he not be described as such in other passages? And yet only Jesus is described as King, carrying out the office of King in the middle of Israel, apparently in the temple. Would David reign from the temple, the house of the God of Jacob?

And it is Jesus who reigns on the throne of His father David, would that throne be a heavenly throne or and earthly one? So Jesus does reign on an earthly throne carrying out earthly duties of King, and the scripture states He reigns on the earthly throne of David forever. And that is the promise of God to David himself, that his descendant, Jesus, would reign on David's throne, as King of Israel, not David himself.

And that is the promise to Israel, that the Messiah, Jesus, would reign on David's throne as King forever - 'For unto us a child is born...the government will be upon his shoulders... of the increase of his governement and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom...from that time on and forever..' Isa 9. 'Over his kingdom', over David's kingdom, forever. Not David, Jesus, King of Israel, forever.


The Messianic kingdom that Israel has been promised is ruled by the Messiah, which is Jesus and not David. When one considers Ezek 37 by itself, one might believe David rules as king in Israel. When one considers all the other scripture passages that refer to the king and Messiah ruling in Israel during the millenium and afterward, it is clear that Jesus is the King being discussed.

[Tevye]

It's okay if you disagree.
Our feelings and thoughts about His Word are important
it's how we learn. By holding fast to what is real and true
and letting go of what is false, incorrect, and untrue we grow closer to God.

While it is completely true that Yeshua will be Israel's Messiah and Highest King
the messages concerning David as their prince forever are also true, and valid.
In no way will people who are meant to be what they are destined to be
diminish the glory that is due to our King of kings, Messiah Yeshua.
We can see through rose colored glasses for our whole life and miss so much
insight into the heart of the Lord and what He has planned for His creation.
The closer I get to the entrance of the jungle, the more I see the vast beauty
of this life and the colorful creativity of our God. There is so much more
that we can see if we would only let go of some things and allow God...

[1whowaits]

Tevye, yes, having some disagreement makes the discussions more interesting. This point about Ezek 37 mentioning David reigning as king is not a major point, but i think it is illustrative.

In general, when scripture describes historical events or doctrinal matters the meaning is straightforward and obvious. But in prophetic scripture the meaning may be obscured or 'concealed', or a reasonable person could interpret a passage more than one way. Rev 18 describes the destruction of Babylon but the city described does not fit Babylon in Iraq, suggsting that another city is in view that is not currently called Babylon, the exact city is obscured for some reason.

Ezek 37 describes David reigning as king over Israel during the millenium while several other passages describe Jesus reigning as King over Israel during the millenium. One could interpret the passage as indicating that David does indeed rule as king over Israel during the millenium but there would appear to be a discrepancy with many other passages that describe Jesus ruling a King. To resolve the discrepancy one could state that David reigns as an 'under-king' under Jesus but the passage appears to be stating that David is 'the' king, not a lesser under-ruler.

For me this raises the question of why the potential discrepancy by mentioning David? Most of prophetic scripture appears to attempt get Israel pointed in the direction of accepting their Messiah, Jesus, as King over Israel, why elevate David? I believe the scripture could be pointing to something with the mentioning of David as king of Israel in the future.

Ezek 37 preceeds Ezek 38 and 39 which discusses Gog-Magog. Currently many Jews believe that the Messiah will appear at the time of Gog-Magog and help rebuild the temple and regather the Jews to the land. Zech 11 appears to discuss the AC as a 'foolish shepherd', which could indicate that the AC is Jew and a leader of Israel. And as the Messiah is described as coming from the line of David, could it be that when Israel is rescued at Gog-Magog, a leader will come forth claiming to be from the line of David? Israel may be looking for a 'David' to be their king, and someone many give them what they are looking for.

So it may be that Ezek 37 is describing Jesus as David because Jesus is a son of David and reigns on David's throne, but David is referred to because Israel may accept a 'false David', a false messiah that could indeed be from the line of David or claim to be David himself.

This is certainly just speculation, but when there appears to a discrepancy in prophetic scripture, some meaning may be present that is not readily apparent. 'It is the glory of God to conceal a matter...' Pr 25.

[Tevye]

'It is the glory of God to conceal a matter...

...and it is the honor of kings... to seek it out...

"and we shall spend an eternity discovering this truth together."- ((((videolink))))

[drdos]

Luk 1:32
(32) He will be a great man and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his ancestor David.

[Mrs. B]

King David will reign in Jerusalem....

Rev. 5:5.....And one of the Elders saith unto me,
Weep Not, Behold, The Lion of the tribe of Judah,
the Root of David,
hath Prevailed to Open the Book..... and to loose the Seven Seals thereof...

Jesus, The Promise Seed.....
Gen. 3:15....And I will put enmity between, thee and the woman, and between Thy Seed and HER SEED;
IT SHALL BRUISE THY HEAD, AND THOU SHALT BRUISE HIS HEEL....

This is the Promise of the Father...
A SEED......every one is born of a seed
God promised a Seed.....Jesus is the seed....The Promise God made in the Garden.....
A seed that would bruise the head of satan...
A second Adam.....who will defeat the devil.......and Jesus is His Name....

Jesus is the Promise seed....
this is why Jesus said.....Ye Must Be Born AGAIN.....
that which is Flesh is Flesh
and that Which is Spirit is Spirit....
Marvel not that I say....Ye Must BE Born AGAIN....

we are born again by the seed.....The Living Word....when we hear about Jesus and We Believe that he is the Promise Seed and that His Blood shed on the Cross is the Holy Sacrifice that God has accepted for our sin atonement....we experience a New Birth.....We are spiritual babies.....but we grow by the Word.....The more you seek the Lord and you learn of His Word...Living Word.....you grow spiritually.....we come to the place that we Know in Whom we Believeth....
and we re prosauted that He is Able to Keep that which we have committed unto Him against that Day.....Glory

Oh How I Love Jesus....
Mrs. B

[drdos]

King David will reign in Jerusalem....

Rev. 5:5.....And one of the Elders saith unto me,
Weep Not, Behold, The Lion of the tribe of Judah,
the Root of David,
hath Prevailed to Open the Book..... and to loose the Seven Seals thereof...

Jesus, The Promise Seed.....
Gen. 3:15....And I will put enmity between, thee and the woman, and between Thy Seed and HER SEED;
IT SHALL BRUISE THY HEAD, AND THOU SHALT BRUISE HIS HEEL....

This is the Promise of the Father...
A SEED......every one is born of a seed
God promised a Seed.....Jesus is the seed....The Promise God made in the Garden.....
A seed that would bruise the head of satan...
A second Adam.....who will defeat the devil.......and Jesus is His Name....

Jesus is the Promise seed....
this is why Jesus said.....Ye Must Be Born AGAIN.....
that which is Flesh is Flesh
and that Which is Spirit is Spirit....
Marvel not that I say....Ye Must BE Born AGAIN....

we are born again by the seed.....The Living Word....when we hear about Jesus and We Believe that he is the Promise Seed and that His Blood shed on the Cross is the Holy Sacrifice that God has accepted for our sin atonement....we experience a New Birth.....We are spiritual babies.....but we grow by the Word.....The more you seek the Lord and you learn of His Word...Living Word.....you grow spiritually.....we come to the place that we Know in Whom we Believeth....
and we re prosauted that He is Able to Keep that which we have committed unto Him against that Day.....Glory

Oh How I Love Jesus....
Mrs. B

[Tevye]

Oh How I Love Jesus....
Mrs. B

Reminds me of a song...

"OH HOW I LOVE JESUS" #2 - a lovely southern style version - ((videolink))